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General discussionGOG Forum Mafia #27: Gameshow Showdown - The Game(1646 posts)(1646 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted June 02, 2015
I have not discussed who I think is scummy Today because I do not have a strong candidate.

So let’s start on the other end, for most of the game Hyper and Hijack have seemed fairly town.

Hijack- I’m not ruling out that Hijack’s Commuter claim could be a scum play. But then why start out playing dodgy at the beginning? I did find it interesting that flubb jumped on Bookwyrm’s wagon and not Hijacks (Bookwyrm’s [url http://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_forum_mafia_27_gameshow_showdown_the_game/post1162 =] One fun thing [/url] ) Why this happened is WIFOM. Hijack may or may not be the reason we have no NK. It’s a possibility. One way or the other, it does not change my opinion. I tend to believe his reasons for selecting and using Commuter.

Hyper – Hyper does a great job a digging into the details and asking questions. The only thing that has caught my eye is the recent back-and-forth between him and adalia. It’s obvious they have different opinions about how many roles may be in play, I’m not certain why it is that important (as far who is right). They are both possibilities that will eventually be answered. Perhaps he sees something in these details that I don’t. I might see a glimmer of the reason in Hyper’s last post. Will consider this when I get to adalia.

This could get long and the dog has been doe-eyeing me for a walk. More on the rest in a bit.
Posted June 02, 2015
I am still reading, don't have time for a full post now. Was having to much fun writing my entry for the serpent/stag competition.
Posted June 02, 2015
I'm going to bed. Good night.

Unofficial Vote count:

JMich: 1 vote - yogsloth, Leonard03

Yogsloth: 2 votes - JMich, adaliabooks

Bookwyrm627: 1 vote - HijacK

Leonard03: 1 vote - Bookwyrm627

Not voting: cristigale, HypersomniacLive.


With eight (8) alive, it takes five (5) votes to reach a majority decision.

No Lynch is automatically invoked on June 5th, which is 4 days from now.
Posted June 02, 2015
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HijacK: Here you go (and it wasn't even that long ago):

http://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_forum_mafia_27_gameshow_showdown_the_game/post1161
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Bookwyrm627: Maybe I'm just being dense, so please humor me. Would you be in favor of a mass claim, or against a mass claim? As far as I can tell, that post only speaks to the method of a mass claim.
It's neither. I already claimed, so I leave it to the x-shot power roles or unlimited shot power roles to do so. If they don't want to start claiming, I'm fine with that. If they do, I'm fine with that as well. Neither situation bothers me as both present pros and cons.
Posted June 02, 2015
So there won't be any more claiming Today, it seems. That's fine.

So time for our two stragglers to cast a vote. (Maybe? Pretty please?) We need to get started. This bloody game has already lasted almost two freakin' months and we're not even through Day 4. Just brutal.

To the players who won't vote and barely participate: Aren't you bored? Why don't you want to play?
Posted June 02, 2015
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cristigale: I’m not certain why it is that important (as far who is right). They are both possibilities that will eventually be answered.
It's not the number as much as the arguments made around it that are actually important if you ask me. I see Hyper's questions as catalysts towards getting little extra bits of information from discussions.

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yogsloth: This bloody game has already lasted almost two freakin' months and we're not even through Day 4. Just brutal.
I miss the old Blitzkrieg style games. They really tested one's awareness, but also had higher chance of miscalculations, mistakes, and less wide scope arguments.

I suppose there are pros and cons to the length of a game.
Posted June 02, 2015
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HypersomniacLive: Yes you did, and I'm using your arguments to show you that it's not as simple as how you put it. But your arguments seem to be quite flexible and adjust to fit the point you're trying to make.
And that risk assessment for scum almost reads like the answer to why you're pushing for a mass claim.

So, the part I pointed out and you conveniently ignored is a logical argument for you, eh?

Assuming that every role may be in the game does not necessarily mean that all players that haven't claimed yet are power roles.

In your claim post, you said to have chosen a bid on Tracker because it's the most useful role for town. you said nth about considering the overrated Doctor role first and dismissing it only due to it being difficult to make good use of.
Perhaps you did pick Tracker because you thought it to be the most useful role for town, but perhaps you didn't do it to help town.

And here you go again - "you only have to hit anyone who used a power"? How would you know who to target? It's not like you have unlimited nights at your disposal to "get a useful result", you only get two shots at this, two shots that could quite easily go to waste for more than one reasons.
You got me. Me and HijacK are scum and we cooked up the commuter thing between us but only realised after that the role cop could out him so I started pushing for a mass claim. Is that really what you're thinking? Credit me with some intelligence, I would be a bit more subtle about pushing for a role claim if the fate of the game for my team relied on it. I think a role claim benefits town because scum are probably going to hit a power role tonight anyway, so we may lose info and results. For example if the Doctor claims and tells us who they protected last night we can look at who was the more likely target between them and HijacK and maybe have confirmed town. Whereas if all cards are on the table scum have to make a difficult choice of which role to take out first and also who is less likely to be protected by the Doctor. Plus I believe it may be possible to at least get an idea of people's alignment based on their role.

So when you say every role being in play doesn't mean the remaining players have power roles presumably you mean me, yogs or HijacK are lying? Because there is literally no other way that is possible. Care to vote for one of us then?

You know what? I didn't mention that I considered Vig or Vengeful either, but decided there would be too much competition for Vig (and look, I was right about that) and Vengeful would be useless as I've never even come close to getting lynched as town, because these details were irrelevant to my claim.

I didn't say hitting someone who used a power was easy, just easier than hitting the NK target if you are Doctor. (If you need me to spell it out, it's easier because there are more people taking an action in any night then there are NK victims) Even with the shot limit I considered Tracker more useful and easier to use than Doctor, hence bidding on Tracker.
Posted June 02, 2015
At the start of the Day almost everyone, besides Hyper and Hijack, was in my neutral category – adalia, Bookwyrm, JMich, Leonard.

Yogs - Yogs started the day as slightly scum. He has been on-and-off my radar throughout the game. At the end of Yesterday his comments about seemingly knowing how the night would end raised my suspicions again. His predictions did not all come true, but if he is scum, part of the no NK could be to lessen the attention on this. Most of today has been a banter with JMich. I give yogs credit for being consistent and tenacious. Yogs leans scum but I’m far from certain.

Adaila – Hyper’s last post made me realize I may have been overlooking subtle tells from Adalia. (BTW, it took forever to get through these posts, I must be in slow mode.). Adalia has seemed eager to discuss roles from the start of the game (posts #47, #54. #96) However in this post, he downplayed a mass claim.
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adaliabooks: While I would normally agree, this game is not a normal game. Even a mass claim wouldn't help town too much. Because all of the townie roles could be in scum hands
Perhaps adalia’s oddest post for me was [url=http://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_forum_mafia_27_gameshow_showdown_the_game/post181 ] this one [/url] where he speculated that Hijack must have bid for Vengeful. I know Hijack has a reputation of being a lone wolf, but it seemed a bit over the top, drawing a lot of attention to a player that adalia stated didn’t necessarily seem scum. I can see this as a scum ploy to get Hijack to reveal his role as well as give other players a reason to look Hijack’s way.

Adalia calls Hyper for discussing soft claims here which seems pretty town but a bit odd after all the role talking. Recently he supports mass role claim, which given the time passed I can see someone changing their minds.

These things so far would probably place adalia a bit behind yogs in my list.

But the post that gives me the most hesitation is this recent one. I did not notice it until Hyper highlighted this part of adalia’s post:
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adaliabooks: Says the man who finds it highly unlikely that all the roles aren't in the game? I did actually include the possibility of the role cop being scum. You quoted it right there in your post. If the Role Cop is NK'd that does indeed suck, but unless we go for the mass claim then there is only a 1 in 6 chance of scum hitting the role cop tonight. It's still a hell of a risk to hope that you will hit the role cop and avoid outing HijacK if he is lying. I find it highly unlikely scum would take that kind of risk.
The context is adalia asserting that it’s risky for scum to collude with the commuter role. So if I read this correctly, adalia says that without a mass claim, there is a 1 in 6 chance of scum hitting the role cop. I would conclude in this scenario that the same chance also applies to the other roles in the game. And yet, adalia is in support of a mass claim?? Which would tell scum who everyone is for certain. This boggles me. If someone believe these odds, how does a mass claim help town? This seems like a scum slip. (BTW, I do not believe the odds for town are this favorable, these are the odds stated in the example.)

I’m not going to vote just yet, but adalia is now at the top of my list. I need some sleep to see if this still rings true with a fresh eye. I’d also like to hear adalia and other’s reactions. Ironically, the reread of adalia’s posts also refreshed my memory on why I’ve been suspicious of yogs. These two are currently my top scum candidates. I find it unlikely that they are scum buddies.

I hope this answered any existing questions.
Posted June 02, 2015
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cristigale: Adaila – Hyper’s last post made me realize I may have been overlooking subtle tells from Adalia. (BTW, it took forever to get through these posts, I must be in slow mode.). Adalia has seemed eager to discuss roles from the start of the game (posts #47, #54. #96) However in this post, he downplayed a mass claim.
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adaliabooks: While I would normally agree, this game is not a normal game. Even a mass claim wouldn't help town too much. Because all of the townie roles could be in scum hands
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cristigale: Perhaps adalia’s oddest post for me was [url=http://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_forum_mafia_27_gameshow_showdown_the_game/post181 ] this one [/url] where he speculated that Hijack must have bid for Vengeful. I know Hijack has a reputation of being a lone wolf, but it seemed a bit over the top, drawing a lot of attention to a player that adalia stated didn’t necessarily seem scum. I can see this as a scum ploy to get Hijack to reveal his role as well as give other players a reason to look Hijack’s way.

Adalia calls Hyper for discussing soft claims here which seems pretty town but a bit odd after all the role talking. Recently he supports mass role claim, which given the time passed I can see someone changing their minds.

These things so far would probably place adalia a bit behind yogs in my list.

But the post that gives me the most hesitation is this recent one. I did not notice it until Hyper highlighted this part of adalia’s post:
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adaliabooks: Says the man who finds it highly unlikely that all the roles aren't in the game? I did actually include the possibility of the role cop being scum. You quoted it right there in your post. If the Role Cop is NK'd that does indeed suck, but unless we go for the mass claim then there is only a 1 in 6 chance of scum hitting the role cop tonight. It's still a hell of a risk to hope that you will hit the role cop and avoid outing HijacK if he is lying. I find it highly unlikely scum would take that kind of risk.
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cristigale: The context is adalia asserting that it’s risky for scum to collude with the commuter role. So if I read this correctly, adalia says that without a mass claim, there is a 1 in 6 chance of scum hitting the role cop. I would conclude in this scenario that the same chance also applies to the other roles in the game. And yet, adalia is in support of a mass claim?? Which would tell scum who everyone is for certain. This boggles me. If someone believe these odds, how does a mass claim help town? This seems like a scum slip. (BTW, I do not believe the odds for town are this favorable, these are the odds stated in the example.)

I’m not going to vote just yet, but adalia is now at the top of my list. I need some sleep to see if this still rings true with a fresh eye. I’d also like to hear adalia and other’s reactions. Ironically, the reread of adalia’s posts also refreshed my memory on why I’ve been suspicious of yogs. These two are currently my top scum candidates. I find it unlikely that they are scum buddies.

I hope this answered any existing questions.
Me and HijacK rarely get along, it goes way back. I thought I had a reasonable idea what he might have planned (turns out I was wrong, but I stand by making the assumption and bringing it up, especially in light of his odd play day 1)

I called Hyper out for drawing attention to players who might possibly have power roles, basically claiming for them, which I still don't consider a town thing to do. The state of the game has massively changed since then anyway, but role claims now are not the same as another player drawing attention to you because you might have a power role. If someone claims now because some of us think a mass role claim is a good idea, that's their choice, what Hyper did was taking choice away from players and making them targets for scum. Funnily enough, trent got NK'd right after Hypet did that.

I've already explained this in ny reply to Hyper (although thinking about it, you are indeed right and the odds are worse for town. I know I'm town and I suspect HijacK is so that means scum actually have a 1 in 4 chance of hitting who they want, although that goes back to 1 in 5 if you assume HijacK is lying)

Mass claim gives the town power roles a little more chance to be effective. The Doctor knows who has what role so can guess who is more likely to be hit. The role blocker has more info to guess who scum is. Ditto for the tracker (or they can track someone and confirm if they did what they were supposed to).
Fact is we're likely to lose a power role tonight one way or the other. If claims are made today we can at least analyse the actions of the power roles and see if we gain anything from them. For example who has the Doctor been protecting? Why did Lift die when he was a fairly logical choice for NK, who did the Doctor protect instead? Has the Doctor been ineffective because they are scum, has the Tracker not claimed because they are? I still think town has much more to gain then scum in the event of a masd role claim.
Posted June 02, 2015
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adaliabooks: [...] Whereas if all cards are on the table scum have to make a difficult choice of which role to take out first and also who is less likely to be protected by the Doctor. Plus I believe it may be possible to at least get an idea of people's alignment based on their role.

[...]
What makes scum's job more difficult? Knowing which town players have which roles and having to decide the order in which to take them out, or not knowing and trying to figure out who the actual town power roles are and shooting in the dark?


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adaliabooks: [...]

You know what? I didn't mention that I considered Vig or Vengeful either, but decided there would be too much competition for Vig (and look, I was right about that) [...]
Really? What happened to it's unlikely that there were 3 bids for the Vigilante role?


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adaliabooks: [...]

I didn't say hitting someone who used a power was easy, just easier than hitting the NK target if you are Doctor. (If you need me to spell it out, it's easier because there are more people taking an action in any night then there are NK victims) Even with the shot limit I considered Tracker more useful and easier to use than Doctor, hence bidding on Tracker.
You're doing a lot of dancing around. In your claim post you said that the reason for going for Tracker was that it is the most useful role to town, nth else.


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adaliabooks: [...]

I've already explained this in ny reply to Hyper (although thinking about it, you are indeed right and the odds are worse for town. I know I'm town and I suspect HijacK is so that means scum actually have a 1 in 4 chance of hitting who they want, although that goes back to 1 in 5 if you assume HijacK is lying)

[...]
I'd think that you and Hijack being town doesn't change the odds. Why use that as an argument instead of your claims?


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adaliabooks: [...]

Fact is we're likely to lose a power role tonight one way or the other. [...]
Is it a fact or is it likely?


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adaliabooks: [...] Funnily enough, trent got NK'd right after Hypet did that.

[...]
Let me refresh everyone's memory on what you said about that:
I do wonder why he was the target, although my thoughts are he may have been NK'd for the benefit of the mod (I know we certainly considered that as scum last game to keep the game going when players couldn't continue). There is of course the he may have had a power role / softclaiming incident and he may have been killed because scum did think he might have a power role, or to set up Hyper in some way (as my first thought is that Hyper is some what suspicious in light of trent's death).
But you know what else is funny? I had also mentioned Lifthrasil, and he was NK'd in N2. You know what is even funnier? I had also mentioned JMich and yogsloth, but none of them died in N3.



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JMich: Yes. Lacking a claim from the role blocker, HijacK's claim is one of the three possible explanations as to why there was no Night Kill.
Could HijacK be lying? Of course. Which means there must be another explanation as to why there was no night kill.
Why only if he's lying? Do you rule out that HijacK may have well used his role, but that the Rolebloker may also have been active and successful, yet doesn't claim because they've not used both their shots yet? If so, why?



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yogsloth: Now we're talking!

Role claim time:

I am Vanilla Town. (Vengeful is out of the way, so no risk to me anymore.) I bid for Vigilante simply with the intention of keeping it out of Scum hands. I bid position #1, taking the chance that I would be the only one to go for it. I did not succeed. Had I landed the role, I would have followed my own advice and tucked it in my pocket. I wouldn't have even used it on JMich!
[emphasis added]

That's quite the odd argument coming from the person that gave a role analysis very early in the game, which suggests that you did quite a bit of thinking and analysing during the biding phase, and has accounted for the usefulness of the role to scum.


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yogsloth: [...]

Ahhh, no. No, actually. I didn't want to role-claim vanilla with vengeful in the game. Isn't that common sense?
The most worrisome part for a town player claiming vanilla is putting a target on other town players, i.e. making others a priority for scum to night-kill.
If you are vanilla town as you claim, I'd expect you to have been more worried about exposing others, yet you don't seem particularly concerned about that.


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yogsloth: [...] You think I haven't been putting forth analysis, pushing for discussion, trying to get people to contribute and discuss [...]
Your last analysis is from May 13,2015. Most of your posts are clashing interactions with JMich (whom you voted in response to him questioning you). You accuse JMich of not contributing, but other than fixating with him, your own contribution mostly consists of a lot of whining about people not contributing or voting enough, dying of boredom, and sarcasm; I have to agree with adaliabooks when he said "Anyone can come in here and shout "Everyone should post, you all suck for not posting more", doesn't make you town".


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yogsloth: [...] I think scum has been holding on to me as a potential lynch strategic candidate, and today might be the day it cashes in. [...]
What makes you think that you're a good lynch strategic candidate? What would scum deprive us from if you got lynched?
Posted June 02, 2015
Yogsloth, I think you're about to die. The only question is how long it will take the votes to trickle in.

There simply is not enough support to lynch Leonard, cristigale, HSL, or me. Hijack appears too town to too many people to be lynched (so if it is a scum ploy, we're almost certainly screwed). That leaves you, JMich, and Adalia.

Hijack is only focused on my brillance, so his vote probably isn't going anywhere (again). His next best scum candidate is maybe/sorta Leonard, but by his own admission he doesn't have much of a read on anyone else. He also isn't getting anything from looking at NK's or wagons.


That means we have 7 votes to work with, and we need 5 to agree on a single player. I'm assuming that none of the candidates are suicidal, leaving 6 votes to actually lynch one of you.

To lynch Adalia, we'd need to pull most of the remaining players.
-Adalia is somewhat higher on my scum list than you are, so I'm fine with lynching Adalia (and will move my vote if enough support gathers).
-I'm pretty sure you'd be willing to go to Adalia if it comes down to you dying or Adalia dying.
-JMich might possibly be swayable. I don't know how strongly he feels about Adalia, but he did say Adalia was creeping toward second scum suspect. I'm not sure how much luck YOU'LL have swaying him, though.
-Leonard might be swayable.

Assuming that both JMich and Leonard can be convinced to move, that means you'd need to convince either cristigale or HSL that Adalia is a better candidate than you are. Good luck with that.

I'm not too confident you can get the votes you need to go after Adalia, but like I said, I'm willing move over if enough support gathers.


Therefore, we're looking at JMich and you. Over all, my impression is that JMich just has more support from players. Or maybe it is that you have less support from players. Ultimately, it amounts to the same end, when considering today's lynch.

-I think I see what JMich has been working towards all game, so I'm more inclined to vote you and dearly hope I'm correct about him.

-Leonard is already on JMich.
-Adalia is already on you. You might be able to sway him to JMich though; he doesn't seem to have any firm candidate. Once again, I'm not sure how much luck YOU'LL have swaying him.

-That leaves cristigale and HSL (once again) for you to sway towards JMich instead of you, and I don't think they'll go for JMich over you.

-----

Ironically enough, I think there just isn't enough time to get the votes needed to lynch Adalia. I considered trying, since he is higher on my scum list than Yog, but I think that if it fails we'll hit No Lynch because there just won't be enough time to reverse course. If you can manage it, Yog, then I'll join a wagon on Adalia. And if you fail, I'll try to get town shuffling along to a victory.

Unvote Leonard.
Vote Yogsloth.

-----

I just ran the numbers on No Lynch, and it isn't a viable way to reliably gain another day. We'd still wind up losing after N5 if everything hits a townie.

No Lynch Numbers:
6v2.
Day 4: 6 - 1 (NK) = 5
Day 5: 5 - 3 (Lynch, NK, Vig) = 2. 2v2, scum wins

-----

Refresh before posting:

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HypersomniacLive: <snip>
And wow, that is a LOT of aruging-after-misinterpreting that HSL just did. I mean, dang. I'm pretty sure I already know the answers to most of those questions, but I'll let the people addressed answer them (unless HSL wants me to answer instead).

I dunno Yog, HSL seems pretty hard after Adalia after all, so you might be able to get him to vote in that direction instead of your direction.
Posted June 02, 2015
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HypersomniacLive: What makes scum's job more difficult? Knowing which town players have which roles and having to decide the order in which to take them out, or not knowing and trying to figure out who the actual town power roles are and shooting in the dark?

Really? What happened to it's unlikely that there were 3 bids for the Vigilante role?

You're doing a lot of dancing around. In your claim post you said that the reason for going for Tracker was that it is the most useful role to town, nth else.

I'd think that you and Hijack being town doesn't change the odds. Why use that as an argument instead of your claims?

Is it a fact or is it likely?

Let me refresh everyone's memory on what you said about that:

I do wonder why he was the target, although my thoughts are he may have been NK'd for the benefit of the mod (I know we certainly considered that as scum last game to keep the game going when players couldn't continue). There is of course the he may have had a power role / softclaiming incident and he may have been killed because scum did think he might have a power role, or to set up Hyper in some way (as my first thought is that Hyper is some what suspicious in light of trent's death).
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HypersomniacLive: But you know what else is funny? I had also mentioned Lifthrasil, and he was NK'd in N2. You know what is even funnier? I had also mentioned JMich and yogsloth, but none of them died in N3.
I think having to work around the WIFOM and decide which roles might be protected is more difficult. Let's say your the Tracker, if scum don't know that but figure you are fairly townie and a good NK target they can hit you and we lose Tracker. If everyone has claimed, the Doctor can then decide to protect you and if scum try to hit you because they want to remove the Tracker they are unsuccessful, or scum hit the Doctor instead and you get another Night to do your stuff. Or scum don't hit the Doctor (which is pretty much the most logical target when roles are revealed) because they want to WIFOM it and the Doctor successfully protects someone that's another failed NK for scum (that actually happened in the Space game if you want an example, Krypsyn and mrkgnao tried to hit the Cop instead of the Doctor after a mass claim and unsurprisingly the Cop was protected)

Eh... by my count there are already three bids for Vig, I believe I said earlier it's unlikely there will be more. Again, you seem determined to twist what I'm saying, when I was making my bid I didn't know how many other players had bid for what but I guessed Vig would be popular and I wouldn't have much chance of getting it. I find it unlikely NOW, that there are more bids for Vig as there are so few players left unclaimed and still a lot of roles with not even a bid on them. I don't see how the knowledge we have now could have had any effect on my bid at the start of the game?

Because that was the main reason. Are you saying that whatever role you bid on you never considered any others? You knew straight away looking at the list which you would bid on? And when you claim are you going to give a breakdown of every role and why you did or didn't bid on them? That seems to be what you expected from me, although you don't ask the same question of yogsloth or HijacK (or any of the now deceased players who had claimed).

Well, it does. Scum know who is town. I know I'm town, if Hijack is too than that only leaves four other town players for scum to choose from, as they aren't likely to NK themselves. They will also know if we are lying or not (or can assume that if we are town we are not) so will know we have no useful roles and aren't worth targeting, therefore there is only a pool of four players for them to choose from, most of which are probably power roles.

It's a fact that we are likely to lose a power role. It's not a fact that we will lose a power role, for all I know scum will be thwarted or choose to kill me. Starting to look a little desperate and nitpicky here...

So... after killing two of the targets you thought had soft claimed scum realised they didn't actually have power roles and changed tactics. Your not really doing yourself any favours pointing that out... in fact, it doesn't look very good at all.
Posted June 02, 2015
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JMich: Yes. Lacking a claim from the role blocker, HijacK's claim is one of the three possible explanations as to why there was no Night Kill.
Could HijacK be lying? Of course. Which means there must be another explanation as to why there was no night kill.
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HypersomniacLive: Why only if he's lying? Do you rule out that HijacK may have well used his role, but that the Rolebloker may also have been active and successful, yet doesn't claim because they've not used both their shots yet? If so, why?
No, not only if HijacK is lying.If HijacK is lying, one of the other possibilities must be the reason we didn't have a night kill. If HijacK isn't lying, then one of the other possibilities may be the reason, but the reason may be HijacK's commute.
I would have expected the role blocker to have already claimed if he had blocked someone last night, especially since HijacK took his sweet time before taking credit for the no kill last night.
Posted June 02, 2015
Now I know how Sage felt.

If I get lynched, I've got nobody to blame but myself. I've done my best, but it looks like it's all gone only for noise.

As much as Bookwyrm's vote shift is terrible looking, obviously jumping on a wagon he hasn't been on at any point in the game, he may be right. I'm probably never going to convince four other players on JMich, and with a pile of votes on me, it's probably all over... but I won't stop trying.

Unlike Sage, I'm not going to cap myself. I'll stand up until the end, but pardon me if I get lazy in the multi-quoting.

I thought I would be a good target for Scum to frame since I'm loud and bouncy and silly and that attracts attention. Town isn't "deprived" of any special thing by my death, other than a consistent motivating factor to drive the game forward - but most players don't seem to want that anyway.

@ HSL, "Go for it" referred to the #1 spot, not the vig role.

If you lynch me - at least do me a favor and do it because you actively think I'm Scum, and not just make it a lazy "get it over with" vote. Then when I flip, go back and look at my wagon, and more importantly, who convinced you that I was Scum. You're going to have to turn it around on them and find Scum Tomorrow or it's game over.

In the meantime, I'm not moving my vote. I'm sticking it where I think it should be.

If the rest of the players really and truly believe that my play this game has been anti-Town and scumlike, then you do what you have to do. But my vote stays on the player who is actually displaying that behavior.
Posted June 02, 2015
Slight edit for clarity above:

The line that starts "@HSL" is the only one directed to him. The paragraph below it ("If you lynch me...") is directed to the group as a whole.
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