It's a real shame that Elite Dangerous isn't getting an offline mode, and the way it was announced really pissed alot of backers off as well. Braben seemed to mention it in newsletter #49 as a second-hand thought, like it wasn't important. How wrong he was there! The thread on the Frontier forums is still going strong and the news has spread quickly to other gaming sites.

Right now, Frontier seem to be burying their heads in the sand and saying little. Whenever Michael Brookes makes a comment, he just says the same thing over and over again. I think they're hoping that it'll go away and everyone will have calmed down by the time of their premiere event on the 22nd. I think they may well be hoping for too much there, especially considering the number of people that have, and are still, claiming refunds. So far, those that have claimed refunds haven't had any word back on them. If any of them are refused, for whatever reason, the anger that's already there will only escalate further.

Frontier claimed they cut the offline game, because it would have been limited and static, but backers weren't too fussed about that. At least there would have been an offline game. They've made this clear to Frontier, but they seem to be ignoring such attempts at a compromise. Some are now starting to suspect that Frontier had other motives for removing offline. One of them being that the online version will have ingame adverts plastered all over the place (one of the revenue streams for the game). The offline version, obviously, wouldn't have that and so wouldn't pay it's way.

But it would, in more ways than they can imagine. It could have easily been separated from the main game and sold, DRM-free, on places such as GoG. That would have helped sell the online game far better than any promotion would have. It may have been "limited" but shit! It would have been Elite! People are still playing the original 1984 version on emulators, so limitation has nothing to do with it.

The game would have been pirated and hacked, true. But again, that would've also helped the online game. I think Braben himself once did an interview (during the Elite : Dangerous kickstarter) on the actual benefits of his software being pirated, saying how it got his software out to a wider audience which resulted in greater sales at no extra cost to his company.

But now they've cut that line off with this decision :(

And if Chris Roberts can make Squadron 42 a fully offline game and even manage to sell it on places like GoG, then that would be quite a coup for him :)

gog.com sells games DRM free, but with multiplayer not always. I didn't say that, just that evidently no one cares. If they did, gog.com would have to address that. But that's just not relevant to your rant.

Also, you make a claim, but you don't support it with anything. So.. yeah, if you use Wikipedia then indeed Steam is 100% DRM infected trash.

See how that works?


Yes, it says multiplayer in some games sold on gog.com contains DRM. So?

No sorry, I am thick. Please explain, using very simple words.

(and speaking of rants :))

Why, are you threatening of making another one? That's not cool.

Also: the fact that it's possible to (crudely) bypass the Steam DRM on some games, doesn't mean DRM free games are available on Steam. But that's another threads, why don't you continue there?

http://www.gog.com/forum/general/list_of_drmfree_games_on_steam

because that thread is not a discussion thread, but informative for those who just want to know which games on Steam are DRM free.

And by (crudely) bypass - do you mean "download the game", because that is all you need to do :)

Wow I didn't know Steam had dropped it's POS client! Great news.

sigh - it is in effect a third party downloader.

You still have not explained what you mean by "(crudely) bypassing"

It is in effect and by design a DRM portal that functions as spyware on your computer.

Crudely bypassing is relying on the game being a portable app that doesn't rely on Steam and just copy it whole. Works for most DOSBox games. They still might be watermarked, so it isn't all that impressive.

I merely asked, since with the DRM free games on Steam, you are not 'bypassing' anything at all (crudely or not :)) more than any DRM free games from gOg. You just start the exe file. and... that's it. Not sure what I bypass.

The problem here, again, is that you still are not clear at all what you define DRM as.

It's not really a problem, you just don't want to admit that Steam is DRM.

Fine by me.

I think the definition is very clear: DMR-free games are games which don't need a client to download, aren't watermarked, but can have DRM in multiplayer because multiplayer is not important. What's so unclear man?

Steam isn't, CEG is. Some games on Steam don't use CEG and can be launched outside of Steam, without the use of any hacks, cracks or anything of the sort. Steam doesn't give a shit what you're doing with your downloaded files and where you launch them, CEG does. Not all games on Steam are CEG enabled, therefore, not all games on Steam contain DRM.

Bloody difficult to argue with facts, isn't it? :-P

hehe. I will not admit it, because I do not think this is the case. And you repeating it as a mantra do not make it so either. You have not explained why this is the case, just saying "because it is".

I am saying Steam in itself is not DRM, because I can get DRM free games from there. I call them DRM free, because I have defined what DRM free means to me earlier.

and that's where you need to prove your point, hopefully with something else than aimless rambling and slogganism. If not, than i will still think I am correct.

Fun Fact that you ignored in the other thread: The files for Carmageddon 1 and 2 that I get from GOG are identical to the ones I get from Steam. So either the games are DRM-Free on Steam, or DRM'd on GOG.

As I've mentioned before, do not confuse installation (or distribution if you prefer) with execution. Steam is a DRM'd distribution/installation method that distributes both DRM'd and DRM-Free games. The distribution method is DRM'd, the files may not be.

GOG uses a DRM'd distribution method to distribute DRM-Free installers which install DRM-Free games.
Microsoft uses a DRM-Free distribution method to distribute both DRM'd and DRM-Free installers for (mostly) DRM'd products.
Linux uses a DRM-Free distribution method to distribute DRM-Free installers for DRM-Free products.

So no, Steam isn't DRM by itself. It's a DRM'd distribution method that bypasses the installer phase and can deliver both DRM'd and DRM-Free products.

I'd argue that steam's DRM'd distribution includes the installation phase - so the installation is DRM'd. You can't get a DRM-free installation from steam. Otherwise, I agree that the games themselves can be DRM-free, and in being so you can just copy elsewhere in place of the installation.

Distribution of paid-for games is necessarily going to be restricted (unless you use an honour system,) and I don't see that as DRM.