Deadline is in a day and a half. I don't like the looks of this vote paralysis.

I have a proposition...

One of our problems is that, from appearances, when spectres do anything they lose their votes (or worse?) which makes it hard to find a majority. To compound this, they also seem to be the only one's who may have powers which can help us.

I have a solution which makes it possible for them to essentially do both...use helpful powers and vote (well kinda).

I have no doubts Bookwyrm is town. He was NK'd before scum knew about spectres. Absolutely no reason scum could possibly NK their own N1. Obviously town.

My suggestion is we put our votes away. From here on out, we make our cases (as usual), but we let Bookwyrm decide who gets lynched and we follow his lead and vote for his choice.

We wouldn't have to worry about having enough votes to form a majority. We'd get a vote from a good player who we know is town.

It seems win win to me. What do you all think? You with me? Or rather with Bookwyrm?

I'm sorry, it really didn't seem like you were trying to understand. But I did respond to your concerns, didn't I? I intended to with the "...it seems absolutely foolish to perform such an experiment at this point in the game, especially since the results won't concretely tell us anything anyway..."

Is there anything else that I can attempt to clear up for you? I really do want to, anything I may have missed from you, or anything that you'd like to try and get my view/thoughts on that you don't quite get fully/why or whatever.

I don't think I could get drunk enough to cast one of those votes.



Problem is, BookWyrm has already publicly made his pick, and you know who it is. All this tells us is that you're content to kill that particular player. Should I feel warm and fuzzy about that?

I think that is a worse proposition than yogsloth's. I think it is a scummy proposition. For several reasons.

To me that almost reads "bookwyrm has his sights on someone that I agree with, let's see if I can
get'er dun!" quick and easy style. And if you are Evil, that means bad news, because wyrm's judgement certainly isn't less fallable than anyone else's, and I'm not confident to just go with whatever someone else thinks is best, just because, like, ever. (like remember that one time adaliabooks just wanted me to vote HijacK "because why not?! let's KILL KILL KILL someone! YAAA!" ?)

*refresh*

hah

You know Hyper...you seem to be single-mindly attacking anyone who dares disagree with you. You have been droning on about the same stupid point for well over a week and all you seem to be doing is creating a distraction.

First, let's really break this down...

When the mods first mentioned spectres and the Exorcist, who really would think they could be lynched or NK'd?
I wouldn't. I think it's a pretty obvious assumption that they could not.

So frankly, your droning on about this for so long is just silly.

You are trying so hard to paint the word "unkillable" as a slip by JMich when it seems to me its just as likely, if not more so, he assumed that was the case. I see no smoking gun. Sue me, that doesn't make me scum.

Buy hey, apparently anyone who isn't following your "great advice" is scummy right? You are becoming like old HijacK.

What I really think is you found a few words you could construe as a "slip" and have been beating it to death hoping to get him lynched. Because as much of a threat scum JMich is to town, town JMich is to scum. And NKing him doesn't remove his late game analysis...

One of you two are scum, that I can almost guarantee. I just think it's more likely you.

You know how much I love it when you do this, right?

It depends on if you're Town or Mafia.
If you're Mafia, I'd expect you to do what you did, and if I were Mafia, I may have attempted the same, minus the first part of your arguments.
If you're Town, I don't think you thought it out all that well, or at least you didn't execute it all that well, and in your place I wouldn't have done what you did. I'd probably have ignored my initial post (#882) completely, leaving everyone to wonder, because as I told you in my post #888: Seeing how things were going, I think that if you hadn't made that post #885, fewer people would have (openly) looked your way, and if you're Town and you were doing the thing I thought you may have been doing, you'd have better chances at succeeding.


But you didn't (that's assuming you're Town and mean "keeping myself as a NK-target"). That argument about which words that "almost" applied to made absolutely zero sense; it was silly, at best, and came across as an attempt to cast doubt about my understanding and judgement.
Additionally, it weakened your following argument, and made it look more like an attempt at fear-mongering than bait, more so since you and I suspect each other since D1, and I told you as much.
So, assuming you're Town, whatever plan you had, his reaction turned you more into a potentially viable lynch-target than a NK-one.
And if you're Town, whatever plan you may still have regarding this, the more you talk about it the less the chance of success.

Now, draw whatever conclusion you desire from this, I'm done discussing it.



It never does to you, nth new.

I understood your arguments about yogsloth's plan just fine, and with everything we now know for certain I agree that it's risky.
But what I said and asked you was not directly about it, but about the theories you throw around.

I presented you the case of the no-majority lynch being a game mechanic introduced by the mod, and not caused by a Spectre. I asked you why in such a scenario it makes more sense it could favour Mafia over Town.
Then I presented you with the case it's a Spectre introduced mechanic, and went along with your theory that yogsloth's Evil and it's his doing. I argued about how that could possibly work, and asked you a couple of things.
My point was that if Spectres have such an ability, and even if yogsloth were Evil, he wouldn't have had the chance to use it N3, and we have nth supporting, or even indicating, that he could have used it Today.

Anyway, I don't see much, if any, point discussing this anymore.



You accuse me of leaving out that adaliabooks seemed to have the same advance knowledge, I present you with the evidence that it's a false accusation, ask you for proof that I've claimed I'm sure no Scum had died so far, and your response is ... this? The same empty arguments you've been repeating in every post of yours to or about me? And I'm the one droning on it?

Whatever, it's pointless talking to you. It's clear that all you care about is to grab any chance you get to repeat your mantra over and over and over again, in hope that some of your mudslinging will stick long enough to get me lynched as Scum when you have nth to support your claims. You're starting to sound worse than drealmer7; that's a mighty accomplishment.

So please, keep singing your song, be the siren that convinces others of my irrefutable scumminess, get me lynched and lead Town to their doom. I'm done here.


I had to attend to other things for the past couple of hours or so, still have to take a closer look at babark, and revisit things with adaliabooks as Scum.

I don't "throw around" theories. I try to present theories that I think might be possible. I try to present all theories that I think make sense to discuss as a group and get feedback on from numerous people so we can try and best figure out what is going on and what to do about it.

With not-knowing much, it is important to keep an open mind to a variety of possibilities at once (keep them all on the table, keep tossing them all around in discussion) and consider all options.

I missed that you were presenting the idea that the non-majority lynch mechanic is a mod. introduced thing and not caused by a Spectre. Sorry. So first let me address that idea.

I don't think that makes much sense at first glance, can you elaborate on your thoughts about it further? Do you think it was a pre-planned trigger if town gets under a certain number of alive players? I could see that being possible, but want to hear more about what you have to say about the mechanic.

My 2nd thought about that is that if it is a mod-introduced mechanic, I would think it would be made to favor Good, not Evil.

My thoughts initially had been that it is a spectre-ability induced mechanic, either by cristi, wyrm, adalia, or yogsloth (who pushed the idea of trying the experiment surrounding it, could that mean he has knowledge of the mechanic, isn't it possible he was able to put it into effect today, and not needed to do it N3?), but now considering it more, I find it equally as possible that it is a mod-mechanic.

So, yeah, no point in discussing it further, I think. We will see if/when it happens and the results after the game is over anyway.

btw, HSL, could you see yourself voting trent today if it came down to it near deadline to prevent no-lynch?

Why do drealmer and RWarehall never talk to each other?

Did it? Really? When adalia was at L-1, I had gathered a measly two votes (trentonlf and yogsloth, votecount on 1090). I also had a "Would prefer JMich, but I'll vote adalia for now" by you. Then there's the almost challenge like "it doesn't look like we can reach majority" post (1106) causing two extra votes to come, almost like someone trying to gauge lynch interest in someone.

Anyway, two questions about the previous day that I've forgotten to ask.
1) What did raise your eyebrow in post 1006?
2) What did you expect I'd do in post 1112 that had you so disappointed I didn't do by post 1120?

so you did poop yourself then? is that a soft-claim of a solid turd?

but, actually, he has wookie-breath, I can't speak with him much without puking on my own feet.

*gets out yoyo collection for more strings yogsloth to grasp at*

you seem oddly desperate, which is odd

did you hear anyone knock on the table three times? I didn't... :þ

Very good point.


whooooooooOOOOOOoooooo.... I am the end table of doooooooooom

treeeeeeeent

treeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeent

you have only two posts in the last two days treeeeeeeeeent

that's seriously bad juju trent

baaaaaaaaaaad juuuuuu juuuuu treeeeeeeeeeeeent

What would you like me to post? It's the same arguments over and over and it's getting us where it always does, nowhere until the deadline is near and then we rush a lynch.

I've said the 4 people I'll vote for, and my vote is currently on JMich. If it's decided that we should move to someone else I will if it's one of the other three.

Sorry I have no pearls of wisdom to share, and to be honest my enthusiasm for this game was about sucked away day 2 and has not really returned. Not saying I'm done or quiting by any means, just that the zest for this game is about gone for me.

My initial thoughts about it being a mod-introduced mechanic are here. I admit not having given it much more thought than that after agentcarr16's post #1397, and a few things Bookweyrm627 and yogsloth have said.


Why does that look possible to you? To add to my post #1353 - so far, we had no day-actions, nor any indication that any are in the game, and whatever abilities Bookwyrm627 and cristigale have/had, everything points to them acting during the Night.
If yogsloth is able to use any of his abilities during the Day, then that would mean one of three things I can think of:
- One (or more?) of the Spectres abilities is a Day-one. Looking back at the exchanges between Bookwyrm627 and cristigale, and the events of past Days, this doesn't seem to be the case. There's a chance neither of them used that specific one, but their exchanges don't seem to support they had/have any.
- There's a chance in when (perhaps also in how?) Spectres can use their abilities. I suppose that's plausible, but it seems to throw the game more out of balance if the lynch outcome can suddenly be influenced midday, more so since we're going by the assumption yogsloth's Evil.
- He's an exception. Why would the mod make an exception for a Mafia Spectre, or worse for yogsloth? Wouldn't that again favour Mafia (more)?

It makes more sense to me that if it's a Spectre ability, and there are at least indications it is, then it was put into effect during the normal Night-phase. Which then leads me to it couldn't have been yogsltoh, even if you consider him Evil.

The more interesting question is - if you're convinced adaliabooks was Scum, what was the motive and benefit for Mafia to spend a NK on one of their own right after they already lost a team-member? Why would they choose to prolong the game when they're already pretty ahead, consequently help Town get closer to our own win-condition, and remain with a single player who'd not only have to find and kill the remaining Town Power-Role but also do it before becoming a lynch-target?
Any benefit from getting insight of what Spectres can do, they already got it, if you think adaliabooks was Scum, and that Mafia-Spectres can continue participating in the scum-chat until permanently removed from the game.


At this point - can't say that I do. I'll try to do a reread on him, but there are others looking more scummy to me, and I really want to take a closer look at babark and revisit things with adalaibooks as Scum before the deadline.
Let me return the question - what are you willing to do to prevent a No-Lynch? I mean besides trying to get others to vote your choice.



Going from zero attention to four votes, with another two players expressing willingness to vote you (cristigale and lotsofchickenwings), I'd say yes, it did.
As for that last bit, you can try to paint it anyway you want; I never hid that I want to lynch you. Oh wait... you wouldn't possibly be implying that I was trying to see if it was worth NK-ing you... would you, now? See, you're again doing that thing I love when you're doing it.

You know what though? The constant attempts at keeping this matter alive, and me in the position to reply to posts about it so that you can add one more pebble to your pile of my scumminess, is starting to smell really fishy... like someone(s) not wanting me to look at and into other players, or perhaps just a certain one... especially as deadline is coming closer.


I'd appreciate it if you provided links next time.

- Post #1006: has been discussed already, it was [emphasis added] "The mod confirming the coroner's report does mean that both cristigale and HijacK claims are most likely true".
Did you really need to ask for clarification? It's not like you made a dozen points in that post, and I already told you it was not the part about re-evaluating your position on adaliabooks.
- Posts #1112 and #1120: the disappointed comment was sarcasm at your continued cheap attempts to discredit, if not outright ridicule, me. Seems pretty important to you, and RWarehall, to reduce what I have to say to nth worth listening to...

Anything else you want me to waste my time on so that I won't look at others and revisit things in the light of recent happenings?