Good question.

Other questions are: did anyone check Yogs or HijacK tonight? IF there really were Death Millers around, I am sure RW would have included some role to counteract that. Like a Role Cop, which gets a 'Death Miller' reading. The question is: should the RC (or something like that), if one exists, reveal himself? Or not yet? That is actually a question to all.
However, we have already established that the 'definitely' in Yog's flip and the missing quotation marks make it look like he was lying. I am guessing that HijacK is lying too. So maybe there is no counter-balancing role to Death Millers around, because there are no actual Death Millers around either and both claims were bogus.

Yes I did, but only after the mod added a town arsonist bodyguard.

Everybody made some sort of appearance already. If someone decided to step out now, after all this time, would you believe them? Would you do a sudden 180 on Hijack's claim and keep trusting him 100%? No really, right? Then is there a point for the investigator to expose themselves at this point? I'd say not worth it.


Maybe. Maybe the delayed partial reveals we seem to be getting are that balancing mechanic. Maybe not.

JMich, you're making me feel terrible about it... I have no defense for it other than it simply didn't click in my mind, and when dedo pointed it out it was like I finding out that you're adopted...
I hate explanations one and three, because one supports that I have indeed gotten dumber and three implies I'm dumb and I can't come up with a coherent lie. I'm not a fan of explanation 2 either, but sleep deprivation is my nemesis during finals periods, so I'll bite the bullet with this one.

Feel free to vote though. My RL obligations have been fulfilled for now. I have gotten A in both of my classes, and I am starting my third class tomorrow, Introduction to Business Law and Ethics. I'm a bit excited and scared. The material looks daunting.

This being said, with 2 extra A's under my belt, my GPA has risen only by 0.01... Currently sitting at 3.88. I need a good chunk above 3.9 in order to be invited into the Phi Kappa Phi Honors Association.

Can I get a summary in PM, please? I'd love to check it out, but that would require me to look through a lot of games and scum/dead/whatever chats. That's more reading that I did for statistics, and I busted my butt for that class.

Hmmm... Fair enough. What struck me as puzzling was why were there so many neutrals? Once I noticed that there is an unusual amount of individuals that don't behave according to a simple Town <-----> Mafia axis alignment, I entertained the idea that there may be in fact no mafia this game and town has to figure out the true enemy.
Alas, I quickly changed my mind when it was pointed out that some people flipped with the quotation marks. It appears that we indeed have a mafia, but this also indicates that there may be a plethora of individuals flipping as town, mafia, or neutral, but be not be what they flip. If you will, it appears a lot of people subscribe to a Miller-like/Godfather-like ability that makes them flip of an alignment that is not theirs. I don't really know what to call people that flip "Neutral" but are something else.

He flipped as Mafia not "Mafia".
Truth be told, if I had figured this out earlier, I could have perhaps questioned him and caught a slip.

Right, but I think there is a difference between Mafia and "Mafia"

Can you blame me? Look at the posts of those that have hounded me since D1 and my claim. There's perfect justification for that there. Last I recall, docbear was given criticism for not defending herself properly. Well, here's me standing up for myself and not giving wolfies and easy time. They can suck it!

I believe there is a certain bias in that regard since I know my PM and all that, but I can't state that for a fact. Maybe I am not biased, maybe people simply rely on previous schemas too much and don't engage in actual critical thinking.

Alas, what's AtE?

I wasn't. I did it preemptively. As I have said, I can't be sure of most things, but I take a stab at them.

Game mechanics.

And what if I was? What do you make of that?

Good, this is exactly how it should be.

Ok, for someone criticism me for being obtuse, you're stretching your argument once again. I have already told you, on more than one occasion too, that I received a PM from RW that contains corrections. I was expecting more than that. Until dedo just made me question reality.

You know what? I'll give it a shot.

@RW: Can you confirm that my first power in the claim post is almost verbatim? Also, can you explain to these fine folks how flipping a different alignment is a power? Thanks

I'm guessing you won't flip an alignment in quotation marks, Hyper. If you did, you would have received a similar PM to mine. So, whatever you would flip, it will be the real deal.

I'm curious how would you have figured that out?

Are you saying that you will flip "Mafia"?

Yeah! You tell em, son! These damn wolves!! Too much? Yeah, a bit too much.

This I didn't get either. People started to use so much "professional" abbreviations lately that I'm starting to think I need to refresh my knowledge on forum mafia.


LOL, a very literal one, too. I actually woke the kid.


Is it just me or is the overall tone that post so different from before?

Elite Bodyguard is a legit role and it's a combination of Bodyguard and Bomb. I have breadcrumbed this since day 1, so Lift is full of it when he says I allegedly "noticed" booksie having bomb powers and I got "inspired by this info." First of all, we don't know how drealmer died exactly, so this is a stretch in every conceivable direction for a relatively boring WIFOM argument.

It sounds to me like someone was fishing for an investigator.

Maybe there's more than just death millers lying around seeing how some people flipped with alignments in quotation brackets.

*refreshes*

I see dedo answered. I willt ackle that post after I hang out with my gf. See you all later.

Yep, I wasn't the biggest fan of that question.

I "could" but I think I'd have to kill you first ;)

But I'll be nice and give you something...
The words "a" "and" and "the" all appear somewhere within your original PM. I hope I didn't break the game revealing that!

*******can someone bump me please I think my post is to long for one post. I can not see a quoting error so trying to split it in half and try. Thank you!!***********


I do try to go back to that part of my post and note there that it is no longer correct or someone else noticed it as well ect. It is not unlike someone else pointing to something I said and that they agree with it too and posting me and saying I agree or you said it first but I concur. But I still thought it or felt it so i prefer not to delete it completely because it is still my thought at the time of reading it and just because someone else posted before I did it does not change what I thought. Like I said I do try to go back and add to my post about someone else having addressed it before me. I missed doing it here. I have not felt well since yesterday, I apologize if I am not as on point as normal, my head is killing me.

My guess is he is still trying to figure out a way to work it into his theory, hence the need for more time. and all the talking when he didnt have time about defending why he needed time instead of just telling us everything and giving us that time he would of been away for to process and talk about what he had to say and have more questions or what not when he came back. That would of been the town thing to do.

I read it as the Elders confirmed the alignment right as they founds the bodies, first thing in the morning, the same time we all saw that bodies too with the comment of well now look at this mess, like its the first time they are seeing it too. If it means that more information needs to be looked into for a confirmation why would they still be looking into adaila and gog bear as we are finding out more information now about them. Why would the Elders be looking for more info on them if they were already confirmed.

I personally think that yogs was in fact mafia and that is why he does not have any "" around his name.

Lets not talk about the lack of a certain role to much as its going to give scum the chance to try to eliminate ( or narrow down) people from having it if they are question if its in the game or not and giving scum one less person to worry about.

How do you know what yogs "real" role was, What if his role really was mafia hitman and he was not lying about that part, the part he was lying about was that his real mafia. Which I think he was from not having "".

bler144 - Died during Night 1 - "Neutral"
drealmer7 - Died during Night 1 - Neutral

My thoughts here are that drealmer was neutral and that bler was either mafia town or neutral but something is hiding it and unless whatever is hiding it is changed, ie someone has that power each night to make the truth come out for a person they target or something in the game needs to happen IE like every night that passes in the game one person lose the "" (could be from RW having numbers assigned to us and using random.org or a dice) and their true alignment comes to light and when they die they would no longer have "". I do not feel that it is impossible for bler to actually be neutral just because he has "". I just feel that the ones without "" have been had the "" removed somehow.

Same thing with
zeogold - Died during Twilight - Town
and
Bookwyrm627 - Died during Night 1 - "Town"

I am sorry to hear you are on the verge of quitting the game. I will sorely miss you and urge you to reconsider. There are always going to be people who do not get along but they should try not to let that spill into a game and if they do not like a person just keep their dislike to themselves and only speak to said person in the game and only about game related stuff. I know it is easier said than done at times and the game can get headed and people can easily take a comment that wasn't meant harmful and take it that way. Or someone can get overly heated trying to make a point and come off like a dick when they didnt mean to. When I start to get pissy I shut the game off and get away from it for a few hours and try to come back with a calmer cooler head. And if someone really urks me and I can not play with them I will stay out of a game with them if I feel I can not keep the game and my feelings for them separated.

I apologize. I read your statement wrong. Yes RW can not come into the game and confirm anything a player posts PM/role wise. I read it as you questioned him about something in your pm and he did not answer/confirm what you asked about.

Second time since coming back from night you are bring up protective roles. I would think the best way not to get others from talking about something is to not keep bring it up and I see talking about who may or not have a protection role not a good thing to do at all. The less information we confirm or in some way narrow down or lead a direction to for scum to follow the better / safer it is for us.

bump

***Thank you for the bump, greatly appreciated.***

So, while we are all waiting patiently for you to have more time to give to the game so you can be around when you post whatever it is you want to share. You do not want us lynching you without giving the time to explain/ role claim. Yet you are finding a lot of time to ask questions and try to get more information and you even say that you are going to try to monitor the discussion so you have time to monitor it but you dont want to claim because you dont have the time to monitor it.. sounds legit /sarcasm.

You are saying above that you never said you could kill or not and left it open because "wolves" are hungry and you were and are NOT NOW going to give them information. Then what are we exactly waiting for if you do not plan to share more??? Seems like discussions are great for you as long as your the one learning and not having to discuss you.

How is it town to have something written up and ready to post but not posting it until the right time it will benefit only you and not town. You have been really worried about yourself a lot so far this game and how things will look for you / towards you and how it may hurt you. Not how it effects town as a whole or how it can help town or if your actions will hurt town. Your actions really seem to be one sided and that side is you.

Yogs brought up socks and not having to do with his role or alignment or flavor. I found the time to go back and read through all of yogs post to see. Sad you have not had the time but did have the time to write up a role claim to have ready. Once again benefits you if the whole clothing thing did end up being correct and benefiting you I would almost bet (almost as betting not allowed) that you have already looked it up and since it was not correct you are just brushing it off as you haven't had the time to look it up and will do it later.


****I am sorry but I have not felt well since yesterday, I have been trying to catch up what I missed from going to bed last night until now. I can no longer ignore my head pounding and I need to go to sleep. It has taken all night since getting on around 6ish to get this far. I will be on in the morning to finish catching up and vote once I do if I still feel the same way I do as of now. I am very sorry I wanted so bad to catch up tonight. I am up to 638/ 17 hours ago****

I'm trying to keep my mind open for signs of RWarehall's jerkiness.

Legitimate roles would be an assumption.

Yes RW could very well have made some crazy roles to be a jerk, and the role Hijack claimed would fit. But, the way Hijack has gone about the whole situation is scummy and I think he's full of it.

** another bump would be great, thank you!!!**


** I am sure I missed some things as well and plan to cover more and the things I have yet to go over since last night/ today. I had to see what Hijacks final claim was and that set me off to look things up hence and go over what he said so far about his actions and abilities and all the contradictions. This is why I am up two hours later and dying to take my nyquil and go to sleep. Grumble damn game and damn Hijack =P Good night all**


**A Miller that knows they are a Miller and flips as such is considered Normal on mafiascum.net. A Miller returns a guilty result if investigated by a Cop, "Miller" if investigated by a Role Cop, and "non-Vanilla" to a Vanilla Cop. The Normal variant of Miller specifically only produces a false guilty to a Cop and Seer, so for example, a Gunsmith will see them as having no gun (unless they have a gun for some other reason). A rather controversial twist is the Death Miller, whose alignment is shown as "Mafia" by the Moderator upon death. **

You say you are a miller. You do not say you are a death miller and death miller is the one that would flip mafia when the mod reveals the flip upon death. Miller from description seems just just return unfavorable aka you have a gun when you don't or you are guilty. However upon a investigation by a player in the game you would show miller not mafia. I dont see the jacket as having anything to do with your role or ability, my opinion is you can't put the thug enforcer bravado behind you and still have that don't screw with me edge or ill take you out.


wait wait wait. You claimed to have protected crisi and if someone came after her you kill them and yourself. Why are you saying I gather most of my night was pretty calm. Whats with the guessing at all if your still alive?

Sounds to me that you were muscle for your boss a reinforcer who had no problem taking out those who got in your way or your gangs.


And im not sure why I didnt pick up on it first time around but you even just agreed above that, that if you were town and if it was harmful to claim you wouldn't have!!

But that investigation would have been during the night and if no one investigated you, you would been protecting people. Instead you seem more worried about people believing you and making sure you stay alive.

You keep saying your role is muscle but you said you are a miller. So your role is not muscle that is just what you used to do as a job. If you are a miller that is your role. The jacket is just something you are holding from your past it is not the thing that makes you investigate as muscle you would investigate as miller and if you are a death miller in death the MOD would be the one to flip you as mafia.

Didn't he say he's going after someone tonight to off them or something like that? Am I imagining all this talk about getting rid of Gamma? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm living under the impression that he's on the offensive in terms of powers.

Aren't you basically says yogs has offensive power and you do too here. Then later you back track on it when its no longer in your interest to have the same exact powers.

connotation: an idea or feeling that a word invokes in addition to its literal or primary meaning.

Sounds exactly like you are trying to say you are reinforcement for your boss/ his gang. That sounds pretty offensive in terms and not really a protection/ protective role.


Once again you say you will flip muscle when that would be / was your occupation. It is not what you would flip when investigated that would be miller and if we end up with mod flips then it would show mafia. And I love your comment here on - don't get caught up on something I needed to change because I became aware of new information and need to adjust what Ive said.

You decide that its better for you not to dig yourself any deeper and not claim anymore. Back tracking on what you said you were going to do when it no longer benefits you soully as a player and not town as a whole.

Yet here are a little earlier saying a claim will benefit town

Woah but yet later in your full role claim you claim to kill anyone that targets the person you protected!!!


once again you are not sure if you might have shot yog and you think it might not have been you who shot bler. Well I would reckon you would know for sure if someone targeted your protection option for the night and you shot them, hence you would have killed yourself in the protection process as you claimed later on.