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HypersomniacLive: I can't seem to find it from a quick skim of your ISO. When you have some time, please point me into the right direction.
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yogsloth: I will still use that as a bump, bler.

Sage is solid and involved, but no strong alignment read yet. Not sure after this much time I would have a real reason to meta read her one way or the other. That's really all. I did really like her cross post with me about doc, and if doc is mafia, I would clear sage for it as Town.
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dedoporno: .............

@flub, you seemed satisfied with Hijack's responses to your questioning, yet your vote is still set on him. Do you still not believe him?
Allow myself to quote myself. Jump to: I am inclined to lynch one of them in order to prove it.


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dedoporno: Ah, OK, it wasn't anything new, people just decided to finally put that vote in. I wonder why it took so long.

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flubbucket: I am inclined to lynch one of them in order to prove it.
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dedoporno: How is that proving anything other than the claimed "false" flip?
Perhaps "prove" is the wrong term. Would NOT lynching him prove towniness??

I have no idea either way. I just see a possibility to garner something of substance.


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dedoporno: ............

@flub, you seemed satisfied with Hijack's responses to your questioning, yet your vote is still set on him. Do you still not believe him?
It's not a question of belief at the moment. I don't want the yogsloth/HijacK claims to go untested. But it can wait for another way to triangulate.

Unvote: HijacK

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HypersomniacLive: .........<snip>.............
Vote: Bob
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flubbucket: Allow myself to quote myself. Jump to: I am inclined to lynch one of them in order to prove it.
I'm sorry, but I fail to see the point in that. I mean, lynch them just in case they are throwing a curved one? OK, I'm not a fan but I can see the reasoning behind it, I'm still not sure if I believe it myself. But lynching one to prove he actually told the truth? What does that bring you? Will you automatically trust the other one if the flip is exactly as claimed? I laughed a bit when I imagined a potential reaction:

"Yep, he told the truth alright. Totally worth it."

I'm sorry if I'm missing the bigger picture here.
What exactly would it prove, though?

"Yep, yog flipped Scum, that proves he was Town"

?????
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yogsloth: Still think poor doc is the wAy to go
Any reason you capped the A? Yeah this really could just be me being so freaken paranoid and trying to figure this clusterf*ck out and my head seeing shit. It really might just be the fact of phone posting but there is the small little thing in the back of my brain that goes; hey look! why is that a large A. Hes talking about which was to go as in maybe plan A. So is this a signal?!

*maybe I do need a toke*

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Bookwyrm627: Then you worked yourselves into starting this game off right by whipping out your unmentionables, slamming them down on the table, and daring town to call your bluff. Boop man, Yog's claim literally describes a mafia goon (investigates as scum, flips as scum, has a NK that can be blocked in some circumstances).

Point of order: I'm pretty sure you two didn't plan dual miller claims because it is an unnecessarily All-In play, and both of you like to win. If you two did actually do that, then I'm tipping my hat with awe at your sizes.
/bows - you sir have a way with words.

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HijacK: Oh, would you look at that? I was right. It seems someone does indeed have a personal vendetta against him. *ding* *ding* *ding*
ding


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HijacK: . Don't get hung on the fact that more information was collected in the meantime. I was unaware of certain things until recently and that changed my thinking of the game.
hmmmm...This screams scum to me. Dont worrry about what I said before Im learning more and correcting so please ignore and move along.


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drealmer7: time to get a better wagon than these 2 lame-o's!

vote lifthrasil
How do you know what is going to be a good wagon or not?

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Bookwyrm627: Maybe he got grounded or something.
please click for my response.

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yogsloth: Do stuff.
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JMich: Allow me to point you towards post 337. I'm not going to do stuff as you said until I get a clarification (which I've already asked).
clarification below
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RWarehall: Gamma has been prodded. Contribute significantly to the game or be replaced or mod-killed (if the other players do not get to you first). Replacement will occur at the start of day 2, should that be necessary.
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HypersomniacLive: I'm pretty sure it hasn't escaped your attention, but let's take another look at the attempt to "break it down so trent sees my way and might remove his vote" that you accuse me. trentonlf switched to HijacK due to not believing the latter's claim in his post #361; that was according to GOG's timestamps 2ds ago. My questioning him didn't start until quite later in post #427; that was according to GOG's timestamps about 22hrs ago. So tell me, how exactly did this work again?
To me it felt like you are trying to get trent to see your reasoning hence he might remove his vote. Im not sure why you are bring hijack into this. I did not mention him at all.

As of right now I am not comfortable with lynching Lift and more so because of whose who are pushing for his lynch over another. And trying to get others to come to their side and change or vote the way they want them too. Yes this is about coming together and figuring things out but not telling people dont vote that way or for those people because they are "lame" Everyone has their own vote and their own minds and trying to push things a certain way is not town at all.

Vote DOCBEAR

I am comfortable with my vote here she has had plenty of time to get into the game and at least try. And saying im only going to pop in once a day now. That is not good at all.
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yogsloth: Still think poor doc is the wAy to go
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Sage103082: Any reason you capped the A? Yeah this really could just be me being so freaken paranoid and trying to figure this clusterf*ck out and my head seeing shit. It really might just be the fact of phone posting but there is the small little thing in the back of my brain that goes; hey look! why is that a large A. Hes talking about which was to go as in maybe plan A. So is this a signal?!
lol, phone posting is the devil. My fingers aren't even fat and yet I can't make them hit the little buttons. Add in my constant fight with autocorrect and you should have seen me cursing to myself like a homeless dude as I try to post.

I solemnly promise, no codes or messages there.

I don't know how the younger generation does it.
Got home late, and aside from the usual skype appt with the kiddo tonight looks like a night I have to actually cook.

But hey, only 50 posts to catch up on and I got a superquick skim in over lunch while shoving food in my face.

Most importantly Hijack doesn't know that Bruce Springsteen is the Boss? v/toe Hjacik!
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flubbucket: [...]

Unvote: HijacK

Vote: Bob
Well, the next vote count will tell us if Bob's on the table Today or not.



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HijacK: [...] I was planning on claiming first thing on Day 2 and after a bit more information came out.[...]
Missed to touch on this yesterday - you have no guarantee you'd be the very first to post D2, but you don't seem to say that that was your plan anyway. So, what if that bit of more information that came out was "I cop-ed HijacK, he's scum"?



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yogsloth: I will still use that as a bump, bler.

Sage is solid and involved, but no strong alignment read yet. Not sure after this much time I would have a real reason to meta read her one way or the other. That's really all. I did really like her cross post with me about doc, and if doc is mafia, I would clear sage for it as Town.
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yogsloth:
No, that was your reply to bler144's question (post #395). I asked you in my post #427 about something in this, but let me repeat my question here:

Are you dismissing the case she could be a third-party? In that case, would she have any reason not to point out what makes docbear1975 scummy?

There's a "to you" missing/implied at the end of that "what makes docbear1975 scummy", as asides from that cross-post, Sage103082 hadn't expressed her view on docbear1975, nor had she voted her until a while ago.


I just realised that I asked yogsloth this question in the same post she took so much issue with, and threw a good amount of shade my way. Can't help but wonder a bit if the two aren't related. Hmm...



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Sage103082: [...] To me it felt like you are trying to get trent to see your reasoning hence he might remove his vote. Im not sure why you are bring hijack into this. I did not mention him at all. [...]
- Sage103082: "You're trying to make trentonlf unvote drealmer7"
- Me: "Emm... trentonlf is voting HijacK for the past 2ds now. How am I trying to make him unvote drealmer7?"
- Sage103082: "I never mentioned HijacK, why are you bringing him into this? You're trying to make trentonlf unvote drealmer7!"

C'mon, Sage103082, seriously?

At the time I made my post #427, trentonlf's vote had been on HijacK for more than a day. How could my questioning him be trying to get him to unvote drealmer7? He had already done that by his own free will for his own reasons. Unless you want to spin some conspiracy between HijacK and me to save drealmer7 from his non-existing wagon at the time I made my post #427, there's absolutely no way you, or anyone else, can make the arguments you tried to make, and expect them to be taken as logical and serious.
Your whole case has zero legs, period. Of course you didn't mention HijacK - had you mentioned him, you know only too well that you couldn't even attempt to try to distract from what my questioning of trentonlf is actually about, let alone spin it the way you did to shade me. But you seemed pretty invested to do it. I wonder why that may be.
I've probably ignored chances to interact w/ cristi, admittedly b/c she's had solid, clean posts consistently. She's solvinating.

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dedoporno: although I did hope it will make sense to Yog flavor-wise.
fair point, though if [whoever said it - wyrm?] is right and part of the setup notion is to make us less reliant on 'solving via claim' I can see as a mod having a temptation to have things be close, but different enough to be suspicious.

Case in point, Wyrm lynching the crap out of CSP in my game. So while it would be nice if it were neat and tidy, I'm not overly concerned by it.

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trentonlf: @bler, I see what you're driving at now. What I meant by my three main suspects was the three people at that time that I would be willing to vote. There was no action there as far as gamma went that made him suspect other than his absence. At the time RW had said gamma had till day 2 and although I believe yog's for the most part I was not counting on him to kill gamma during the night. Gamma's extends absence was a detriment to the game imo so I was willing to lynch him.
Satisfactory answer, thanks.

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drealmer7: bler, seriously, I correct you every time, and I think each time I correct you I am unsure if you see it because you don't respond to it - go back and look please, never ever ever L-2 claims for me - grrrrrrrrrrrr
I'm glad we've solved this important conflict.



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JMich: At least I wasn't here for the RVS stage...
It was like 30 posts long. Welcome to the home, old man and/or lady!

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Bookwyrm627: What is the full picture, as you see it?


-Two days ago I was still in the mood to wait and see if she'd start taking some of the suggestions on how to get more involved. Two days ago it looked like people were ready to run her up the lynch pole for basically being a non-contributor.

-Take a look at the player list. Which players, if scum, do you think will try to start a counter-wagon to save scum!Docbear? Will any of them not just throw her under the bus? What do you think of the reasons for people voting and not voting her? Which of those reasons are AI?

According to official vote counts, Hijack didn't have any votes at all when I voted Gamma. He picked up two of his votes while I was afk yesterday, so what's your point about the length of Hijack's wagon in comparison to Doc's?
The full https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TyR3gIeG90]
picture.[/url] Oh yeah!

On the last point you could be right, I was thinking in the present as I was typing not really looking at progression.

On "who would" well, it's hard to prove a counter-factual. Would really depend, but I can see a number of people trying to at least distract/deflect but the way we played it, they never even seemingly had to choose.
Skype no show. /sadblernda

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yogsloth: AAAAAAAAAAAAAJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJHJHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
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JMich: I believe the phrase you're looking for is "GRAAAAAAH!!!!!"
The man makes a good point.

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HypersomniacLive: Did I say I want to lynch either of the Miller(s)? I said I'm not sure I buy his claim. Still mulling over it. yogsloth's too, to be honest.

I'm a tad too lazy to go back and look for the exact post, but I seem to remember that you said at some point that you'd be willing to vote for Bookwyrm627. Could you elaborate a bit as to what for?
I don't know that you did - bit different from the other time. Here I started with a very tight point of fact in response to you (indeed, noting it was NOT going to be a defense) that kinda sprawled out into editorial opinion directed at no one in particular that was very much a defense.

Go me.

on wyrm, I'd commented earlier on his opening sequence (opener through flub vote), then really didn't like the gamma vote. It defied logic imo. Thus the willing to vote list appearance.

Like Drealmer I don't really love his explanation for 'why not Doc before but Docnow!' either. But he has an explanation for that, at least, that is coherent whether or not I agree with it (I mostly don't).

Considering how many other people make less sense than he at the moment, I'm moving back towards meh. He did also make one subtle comment somewhere (last night?) that I townread.

As a practical matter, it's like 50/50 I'll be around at all tomorrow, so at this point given the votes on the table as a practical matter it's Doc or Lift for me anyway, even if he hadn't dropped down the radar a bit.

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HypersomniacLive: I'm pretty sure that bler144 has this correct. I can recall a discussion that JMich was in arguing against L-2 claims, and you arguing the opposite. Not particularly inclined at the moment to go find which game that was in, but am pretty sure my memory doesn't fail me on this.
I'm glad we've solved this important conflict.
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drealmer7: [...] 3 days ago makes something irrelevant completely? still felt worth commenting on, and I still feel like it was, he's a good scumlean for me [...]
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HypersomniacLive: Why is he a good scumlean again?
"good" as in he's on the side of leaning scum for me in a decent capacity (not just some 1 weak flimsy thing), mostly I think the vote on me is sketch and he left it on a bit long and his reasons are weak, but I haven't liked the tone of hardly any of his posts in general either - I think he also makes a good one of those pre-mentioned in-sight to slaughter targets...

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drealmer7: bler, seriously, I correct you every time, and I think each time I correct you I am unsure if you see it because you don't respond to it - go back and look please, never ever ever L-2 claims for me - grrrrrrrrrrrr [...].
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HypersomniacLive: I'm pretty sure that bler144 has this correct. I can recall a discussion that JMich was in arguing against L-2 claims, and you arguing the opposite. Not particularly inclined at the moment to go find which game that was in, but am pretty sure my memory doesn't fail me on this.
OMFG, NO! GO LOOK IT UP. EVERY FARKING TIME! JMich is the one who is okay with L-2 claims, I'm pretty sure. Regardless, I AM NOT, GET IT CORRECT, PLEASE. geebus, I'll repeat it again just to be sure. ONLY L-1 CLAIMS!
I think it is only good to do it at L-1 because it makes scum be in the position that, if all of scum aren't already on the wagon, they have to decide if they are going to hammer it (because most likely then the claim is true and scum knows if they want to / how much they want to remove that role/player from the game and if the hammer is explainable from their position and other factors that TOTALLY DISAPPEAR / AREN'T THERE if the claim comes at L-2.)

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drealmer7: [...] HSL and I seeing eye to eye on a few things - not sure how this sits with me in the long run but I'm liking it so far, maybe we've had a breakthrough? [...]
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HypersomniacLive: I'm actually starting to get worried here.
don't worry, the feeling is mutual I think=, at least in that I'm keeping an eye on you (heh), and it's not going un-noted where we line up and where we don't - btw I like your pickings at sage in the same as all that ^

agree with dedo+yogs about the "proving" the mafia flip claims in RE: flub

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Sage103082: How do you know what is going to be a good wagon or not?
clearly I am claiming to be psychic (no, this is not a softclaim) and can predict the outcome of the game - *sarcasm*

Obviously it's what I think is a good wagon. Because I think it is going to yield scum, and even if it doesn't yield scum, the composition of it in relation to how lift has played through D1 will provide a good deal to analyze.

my GD cat is in heat, AGAIN - 3rd time in 1.5 months - fucking time of year! isn't it grand (ohhhya, btw, I am gearing up for another night-walk - FIREFLIES!!!)

ohandlook, I'm caught up

VOTE time, mofos~ take a stance and state it and vote vote vote - wtf so often taking it to deadline? clearly one of these wagons is scum btw I think?
Sorry for the confusion. JMich can start posting any time. I changed my mind as I thought we'd hear a "peep" out of Gamma, but still might have to replace him.
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yogsloth: Still think poor doc is the wAy to go
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Sage103082: Any reason you capped the A? Yeah this really could just be me being so freaken paranoid and trying to figure this clusterf*ck out and my head seeing shit. It really might just be the fact of phone posting but there is the small little thing in the back of my brain that goes; hey look! why is that a large A. Hes talking about which was to go as in maybe plan A. So is this a signal?!

*maybe I do need a toke*
Yogs N0: "All right team, listen up - when I type a capital A in the middle of a three-letter word, that's the sign!!!"
Rest of team: "Sign for what?"
Yogs: "You'll know what to do when you see it, ya lAzy arses!"


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drealmer7: OMFG, NO! GO LOOK IT UP. EVERY FARKING TIME! JMich is the one who is okay with L-2 claims, I'm pretty sure. Regardless, I AM NOT, GET IT CORRECT, PLEASE. geebus, I'll repeat it again just to be sure. ONLY L-1 CLAIMS!
Looking it up would take all the fun out of it.

Whether I was right or wrong - either really.
______
I'm fine with either doc/lift at this point. Not voting Hijack. Firedrill would be dumb.

Will say that - and I think this was clear a few days ago - that D1 claiming was going to be Doc's best chance for clearing herself if town. given the sub I'm not sure leaving her for yogs to decide without her having claimed is really doing her favors.

Albeit it does seem like it would be doing JMich a favor.
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Sage103082: hmmmm...This screams scum to me. Dont worrry about what I said before Im learning more and correcting so please ignore and move along.
Why? I wasn't exactly the only one that was unaware of no role flip after lynch. I never read the sign up thread beyond the OP, and even then I forget most of it because I rely on the game thread OP for the most part. I mean, I know that is my fault, but if you're going to hold that against me, you should also hold it against the other half of the players that were unaware as well.

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HypersomniacLive: Missed to touch on this yesterday - you have no guarantee you'd be the very first to post D2, but you don't seem to say that that was your plan anyway. So, what if that bit of more information that came out was "I cop-ed HijacK, he's scum"?
By "first thing on Day 2" is whenever I got to post, that would be the first thing I posted. Not that I would patiently wait for the exact time of Day 2 start to be the very first to post. And I was willing to take that risk over getting to be a poor man's policy lynch on Day 1. To be honest, it barely even crossed my mind. I just knew it would be better to claim on Day 2.
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Sage103082: hmmmm...This screams scum to me. Dont worrry about what I said before Im learning more and correcting so please ignore and move along.
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HijacK: Why? I wasn't exactly the only one that was unaware of no role flip after lynch. I never read the sign up thread beyond the OP, and even then I forget most of it because I rely on the game thread OP for the most part. I mean, I know that is my fault, but if you're going to hold that against me, you should also hold it against the other half of the players that were unaware as well.
Technically it was IN the OP, so your statement implies you did read it. ;)

But yeah, strange place to sock a game-critical detail.