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General discussionForum Mafia #32: Booze, Blood and Bullets: The Prohibition(1735 posts)(1735 posts)
(1735 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted November 18, 2015
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adaliabooks: [...]

Who's to say a Coroner wouldn't automatically investigate any death and get the info immediately? It makes as much sense as having to wait a night to actively choose to investigate a player.
Just rereading the scum thread from last game, I'd hoped I could point out where I hummed and hawed over how to claim Coroner, but if I did it out loud I didn't do it in the chat, which does not help at all.

I had researched the Coroner role (there's not much to research) and as mentioned decided to claim that I needed to investigate (as it was more convenient for me to do so), while still thinking that was actually a variant of the role rather than it's usual working.

[...]
Well, that sucks, doesn't it?

You can try to spin that as much as you want, but I was there from the beginning, and nth of this ever came up.


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adaliabooks: [...] Yogs, care to help here? I'm fairly sure that narrow's the choices for your role right down... [...]
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adaliabooks: Very useful. So you're not the Coroner and don't have JMich's flip info? [...]
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adaliabooks: [...] Funnily enough, I found JMich quite suspicious after the flip for having said he would hammer but holding back, yet he has turned up dead, and without a flip to boot. I think there is something fishy going on here.
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adaliabooks: [...] As for getting yogs to claim. Yogs has claimed a role, the role he was suspected of having has been all but confirmed by the lack of a flip for JMich. Under those circumstances I would expect him to report a result. Maybe he is PGO after all, but you've got to admit it's a hell of a coincidence, no?
(I don't think yog's is scum, he could still be a Janitor or something but I doubt it. I just think having a flip for JMich might be useful, you know) [...]
You know adaliabooks, the more you talk the more it looks, sounds and smells like a plan you knitted with your buddies.


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adaliabooks: [...] Oh, and I forgot to mention. I was locked in my room last night. I presume a roleblock or Jail.
Forgot to ask you earlier - why do you only presume?
Posted November 18, 2015
JFCWYJFDIA?
Posted November 18, 2015
JesusFnChristWillYouJustDoItAlready?

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yogsloth: JFCWYJFDIA?
Posted November 18, 2015
Are you suffering from some sort of post-restriction, yogsloth? Or are you having a stroke or something?
Posted November 18, 2015
Call the paramedics! Tell them they'll have to break in the window because I locked the chimney!
Posted November 18, 2015
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yogsloth: Call the paramedics! Tell them they'll have to break in the window because I locked the chimney!
No love for (Secret trentonlf) Santa?
Posted November 18, 2015
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yogsloth: btw, I'm all bent out of shape nobody has congratulated me on actually using an interrobang.
Congrats...on whatever that is.

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Krypsyn: Heh.
Heh. True, and I'm probably overthinking it.

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adaliabooks: 1) As for getting yogs to claim. Yogs has claimed a role, the role he was suspected of having has been all but confirmed by the lack of a flip for JMich. Under those circumstances I would expect him to report a result. Maybe he is PGO after all, but you've got to admit it's a hell of a coincidence, no?
(I don't think yog's is scum, he could still be a Janitor or something but I doubt it. I just think having a flip for JMich might be useful, you know)

2) I get what you are saying and where you are coming from, but if someone wants to play (and the girl in your example sounds like what she really didn't like was actually being on the soccer team) then I don't think it's up to us to decide the way they play is wrong and we don't want them here. We put up with HijacK after all. (sorry HijacK!)
2) She liked being on the soccer team. She just didn't like anything about what being on the team actually required. And Hijack puts up with the risk that his playstyle will get him killed. Even though the evidence would suggest the contrary anyway.

In any case, I think many of us who voted for P1na would dispute that "playstyle" was the issue, even though you seem determined to stand on that interpretation. But this seems like a distraction from today's purpose at present.

1) Do you think yogs is a smart player? If he is town, and coroner, and has information that would swing the game for town, don't you think he would, y'know volunteer that at an appropriate time without needing to be pressed?

Anyway, I've talked long enough. Your poke at him really only makes sense to me if you think he's scum. And yet you seem to be pretty half-hearted about actually making any argument that he's scum.

That does make me curious, but I'll spare y'all my crazy theories.
Posted November 18, 2015
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Ixamyakxim: Vote Bookwyrm

I think you screwed up yesterday and you knew about the no flip in advance AND you seemed to be trying to pry the role of coroner out of yogsloth.
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HypersomniacLive: [emphasis added]

Would you mind telling us how he'd know that? Just to be clear about what you're implying here.
I'm not implying anything - I think there's a strong likelihood he's scum and he tipped his hand about knowing the no flip in advance. He has this long post of faux analysis with dubious value to town:

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Bookwyrm627: Game 24 (Space Ships):
Adalia Was Mafia StrongMan, Claimed Paranoid Gun Owner
Krypsyn Was Watcher, Claimed Watcher
Mrkgnao Was Role Cop, Claimed JOAT (1x Follower ability, others unclaimed)

Game 25 (Milk):
RW (Serial Killer), Claimed SK
Dedo Was Godfather, Didn't Claim?
Sage Was Godfather, Claimed Gun smith
Ixam Was Rolecop, Didn't claim
TwilightBard Was Rolecop, Didn't Claim?

Game 26 (Stalker):
Adalia Was Goon, Claimed CPR Doctor
CSPVG Was Goon, Didn't Claim
Flub Was Goon, Claimed Neutral Survivor I think? [Screw that. I'm not retranslating all the zombie.]
Krypsyn Was Goon, Didn't claim?

Sage (Neutral Survivor), Roughly JOAT

Game 27 (Gameshow):
JMich Was Doctor, Claimed Doctor
Flub Was Vanilla, Claimed Vanilla
Cristigale Was Tracker, Claimed Tracker

Game 28 (Grand Oak Gallows):
Dedo Was Compulsive FireFighter, Didn't Claim
RW Was Roleblocker, Claimed Handyman (JOAT with watcher and roleblocker at least)
Yogsloth Was Mafia Fighter (several powers), soft Claimed JOAT variant? (commute, role cop)

Flub Was Arsonist, Claimed [Town] Arsonist
JMich was Town Guard of Arsonist, Didn't Claim?

Game 29 (LotR):
Wyrm Was Doctor, Claimed Doctor
Quad Was Cop, Claimed Cop
Hijack Was Strongman, Claimed Bulletproof Berserker

Game 30 (Murder Mansion):
CSPVG Was Pickpocket, Claimed Neutral Thief
Krypsyn Was Thug (Strongman), Claimed Restriction Preventer
Adalia Was Imitator, Claimed Imitator
BlueMooner Was Intimidator (Restrictor), Didn't Claim?

Game 31 (Space Station):
Adalia Was a Weirdo, Claimed Coroner
Yogsloth Was a Weirdo, Didn't Claim?
Hijack Was a Weirdo, Claimed Jailer
mchack Was a Weirdo, Didn't claim?

=====

There are certain filters to be applied to the list of claims:
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yogsloth: I have a role in this game that is the exact role false-claimed by Scum in a game in which I participated in some capacity.

Hint: It’s not CPR doctor.
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Bookwyrm627:
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yogsloth: For me "Scum" means the informed minority, i.e., Mafia. I don't think of anti-Town neutral as Scum by default, but I understand that position. Just semantics. But I tend to think of Neutral as a third team unto themselves rather than lump them in with Mafia.
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Bookwyrm627: With these filters in place, the list becomes this:
-Paranoid Gun Owner
-JOAT (1x Follower ability, others unclaimed)
-Gun smith
-Neutral Survivor with a searching ability
-Handyman (JOAT with watcher and roleblocker at least)
-Yogsloth Was Mafia Fighter (several powers), soft Claimed JOAT variant? (commute, role cop at least)
-Bulletproof Berserker
-CSPVG Was Pickpocket, Claimed Neutral Thief
-Restriction Preventer
-Coroner
-Jailer

I feel safe knocking off a few more powers for various reasons:
-Gun Smith seems out of place and weak.
-JOAT is copied a few times on the list, with varying shot claims.
-Yog claimed to be Town, not Neutral (and thus not Survivor).
-Bulletproof Berserker seems absurd. Also neutral.
-CSPVG basically claimed his role, but not his alignment. Not a false role claim.
-I feel safe assuming restrictions aren't the thing this game that they were in RW's game.

So, what could he be?
-PGO
-JOAT (abilities unknown)
-Coroner
-Jailer

Lets look at another claim post of his, and see if there is anything to glean. Some snipping done for length:
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yogsloth: Rummaging through my PM. I don't see anything too promising, so I'll leave some subtle breadcrumbs:

I hope I don't cop to knowing too much, after watching closely. I might be a little convinced everyone is out to get me and my excellent rifle which I also have legal paperwork for. This is totally not a role claim.

"I am town Doc"
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Bookwyrm627: Implications of cop (and maybe a N0 action), tracker or watcher, PGO or Vig, and "Doc" (he didn't finish out "doctor"). However, he also says "This is totally not a role claim", which may apply to either end (or both) of these subtle hints.
Only PGO from this list would fit with his talk about the scum false claim, but is it valid when he says this isn't a role claim?

Lastly, I see two ways of looking at his "Hint: It’s not CPR doctor". 1) It isn't an outrageous role (a la Bulletproof Berserker), or 2) Adalia is the one that made the false claim which matches to Yog's current role.

So, one last question Yog: Should we expect to not get flips this game?
Of which his only important conclusion is the bit where he presses yog on if yog is coroner. yog actually seems to shoot that notion down in a later post, but I thought there were a few more instances after this where Bookwyrm continues to imply no flips and searches for a coroner.
Posted November 18, 2015
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Krypsyn: The joke wasn't the main problem. It was the L-6 Vanilla Town psuedo-softclaim. There might be decent reasons for a vanilla town to role-claim, but I can't think of any good reasons to claim so early.

Can you?
He said he meant vanilla as in normal role, not some made-up one specifically for the setup. I won't deny it wasn't the best move, but I didn't find it scummy.

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HypersomniacLive: Do you consider his reply to me (post #469) also part of the joke? Is that why you kept saying that it's a mistake to go for him? Or did you stop reading the thread after he made his initial joke?
Post 469 seems like a semi-sarcastic statement that his joke was being taken too literally. And then going on to point out that it would make no sense as a real play.

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Ixamyakxim: snip
So you think Bookwyrm is a scum janitor? Otherwise how would he know about no flips? N0 scum chat?
Posted November 18, 2015
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bler144: To this point, no one has asked the most important question:

Does the fact that the game restarted well in advance of deadline prove that Hijack is not scum? That's mostly a joke, but...it was my first thought when I saw the game was up already.

..............<snip>............
I'm on this site daily so keeping track of game time start isn't something I consider. I just look at favorites and see if there are new posts.

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bler144: ..............<snip>............

1) Do you think yogs is a smart player? If he is town, and coroner, and has information that would swing the game for town, don't you think he would, y'know volunteer that at an appropriate time without needing to be pressed?


..............<snip>............
Do you think if yogsloth is lying about his role, JMich would be the first player in line to vote for his lynch??


Was going to point everyone to P1na's posts #469 & 516 but it seems Leonard03 has done so.
Posted November 18, 2015
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Leonard03: So you think Bookwyrm is a scum janitor? Otherwise how would he know about no flips? N0 scum chat?
I think he is scum and can cause a no flip - if that's the only option for a role then yeah I could see that - also thanks for the post - I screwed up the end quoting of my last post - it should look like this:


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Bookwyrm627: So, one last question Yog: Should we expect to not get flips this game?
AND THIS PART IS WHAT I WANTED TO WRITE OUTSIDE OF BOOK'S QUOTE TO END THE POST

It is NOT a part of Bookwyrm's post:

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Ixamyakxim: Of which his only important conclusion is the bit where he presses yog on if yog is coroner. yog actually seems to shoot that notion down in a later post, but I thought there were a few more instances after this where Bookwyrm continues to search for a coroner.
Posted November 18, 2015
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flubbucket: Do you think if yogsloth is lying about his role, JMich would be the first player in line to vote for his lynch??

Was going to point everyone to P1na's posts #469 & 516 but it seems Leonard03 has done so.
Do you think trying to dig P1na out of his hole a Day later is what you want to be seen as doing right now?

And by your comment above, I assume you believe I have:
a) role claimed
b) lied about it
c) arraigned to have JMich killed to cover it up

Or... are you just throwing that out there? Ya know, to see what'll stick?
Posted November 18, 2015
I like how some still argue that P1na's posts were forthcoming and honest, even after his flip.
I wonder what purpose it may serve.
Posted November 18, 2015
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HypersomniacLive: I like how some still argue that P1na's posts were forthcoming and honest, even after his flip.
I wonder what purpose it may serve.
You mean you can't trust the word of scum! What has this world come too....
Posted November 18, 2015
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HypersomniacLive: I like how some still argue that P1na's posts were forthcoming and honest, even after his flip.
I wonder what purpose it may serve.
You can reply to my post if you want to say something to me you know. :P
And I was explaining what I was thinking at the time, not what I think now.
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionForum Mafia #32: Booze, Blood and Bullets: The Prohibition(1735 posts)(1735 posts)
(1735 posts)