Edit By Way of Posting -

I forgot to add that back when Scene was still Scene, I really was expecting him to go after Pooka. He seemed to think (or perhaps know) that they were of different alignments. We've scene Scum!Scene in the past try to have someone eliminated that he thought was a neutral 3rd party alignment, which would be a safe choice for scum.

I've been looking at Scene and Pooka wondering if this was a repeat of that, especially since more than a few of you are proving that you don't read the setup post. It's really unfortunate that he just disappeared on us (and I do hope that he's alright.)

I somehow missed this -

I'm mostly grasping at straws because I do think that scum has been active more so in their day chat than here. We could go back to picking off each other, which I think is what their primary goal is or we can just let them decide who gets eliminated next.


unvote

I'm going to go take a nap even though it's still the morning. I think it's evening over in Europe, so don't expect much in the way of posts until tomorrow.

Wake up sheeples? Cute.

I think if you haven't noticed already. I'm still voting you and I'm serious about it. So naturally I'm not inclined to listen to you about electing Trent or whatever, in fact this makes me quite a little bit more cautious about him.

I also like that you called out Catventurer for being "inactive", but, for all I know, she might as well be the most active player here, and we're definitely failing her by sleeping our butts off (intentionally or unintentionally). This just seems to be like random lashing out because you're gaining just a bit more heat than you would have hoped to.

The elect mechanic needs to be revised though. In Secret Hitler, Hitler doesn't need an unanimous vote and he's also on the scum side, to compensate everyone else can also become Chancellor. Here, the Pope can only be elected if he is Hitler (in other words: scum) or scum are really sleeping on the wheel. I dunno, it just doesn't seem to be it.

I'll post later when I'm not on mobile, but once again, the experimental theme is sick, thanks GOG.

Just saw after I made the post that Flocke also recommended mchack for Popedom. Why?
If not for Scene/Flocke, I'd pop my investigation vote on mchack simply because he was the biggest proponent of investigating Farky, even down to getting me to actually vote on him That and his opener post after Farky's flip kinda does look LAMISC to me, lamenting the loss of a Catholic.

wait, what? you have seen that nothing in her quote is serious and Flocke isn't even electing Trent, but that's why you are now quite a bit more cautious about trent? This does not compute. It's a cynical scum post, trying to get us off target and you let yourself be manipulated by that? really?

So you are thinking about mechanics. Tell me then, where exactly my reasoning is wrong. If we pick a Town pope (or town hitler whatever) only town will elect them. maybe 1 or 2 scum but never all because they loose the game then. So the last person(s) not voting after we get 5-7 elect votes (so e-1) are scum. Then we can just investigate them.
Really just boils down to if we can trust trent to be town.
Where has he given you the impression that he isn't? Flocke is searching really hard and only found another game she played with him, but nothing in this game. And this is from a likely scum!Flocke. So if we ever have a chance to pull this of it's now and with Trent. We already have 4 elect votes. so only 1-3 missing and it's off to the lynch investigation block for the last one not electing trent. And if you're town. Don't be the last one not electing Trent. This would be really Anti-Town.
So where exactly does this logic fail?


I like some good cynicism. But this looks like flailing. If you just don't like to elect trent, then don't and there is no chance that trent get's elected. Easy as that. Don't know why you would want to put off others from using the elect mechanic, other than that it might be dangerous for outing your team.

Yes, well and that's why we got another mechanic at play here to suss out scum: the election mechanic. But you don't want people using that. see your own quote above.

So the only ones not on your scumlist are ... me and joppo? really now? interesting.

Why would I take you disengaging from the game personally? When it started, I wasn’t even in the game. If anything, I’m frustrated with lack of participation. First game I played, my low participation contributed to my lynch and now that counts for prettx much everybody. On the other hand, I’m grateful, not to have to respond to 50+ posts every few hours.

OK, you made me look at my posts. I have no idea where you take it from, that I think it’s strange, that you disappear for long periods of time. I kept stressing, that I’m displeased with you not doing anything anymore. If you’re talking about me being surprised about input from you specifically, well, you stated multiple times, you don’t want to do that. But then you did. → Surprise.


So, this is not a „think you’re town, but better than scum deciding whom to investigate“. Good to know.

Lack of participation. But I would be one of those beginning next week anyway.
What heat? There is nothing happening around here.
Is this a coordinated effort by Cat and you to try to get to my psychologically? That was a rhetoric question, by the way.


I stated why, when I voted for election.
And finishing that off with a clear „You better fall in line because you’re next“ for mchack. That’s nice. But to be fair, it used to be, we give multiple candidates, so there can be discussion and hopefully less back and forth around deadline.

This isn’t gonna work. Everyone has their own way to play, their own motives to do or not do things, that goes for town and scum. Simple scenario: Everyone except one votes to elect trent. „The last one out“ comes online and sees, trent’s about to be elected, but is a town player, who naturally refuses to elect, because that means all scum are on board, which would likely mean, trent is scum himself.. Unless scum decided to „have some fun“, because now that poor townie is under scrutiny, like you suggest. It isn’t gonna work. Never say never, but it is very unlikely. Scum are not stupid.


Let me try to explain how things „work“ for me: There is no townlist, because then I would never look at that player/those players on it ever again and probably lose. Everyone is on the scumlist by default. But it is a fact, that there are only X number of scum players in a game, so I have to prioritize: Who looks most scummy and why.
At least, that is how I try to operate. There was a game, where a sub stepped in for me, where I didn’t operate by that, but that game went badly.

You make some good points about Scene Flocke and scum hiding among less active players. Might go back and look at scene's postings to see if anything stands out when I having free time.

Again, sorry to hear and I also hoping the fires aren't putting your home at risk.

Why does this sounding to me like 'haaaa, we should voting for me but not for reals so something gets done. I'm so townie! No don't seriously be voting me peoples!'?

You knowing what also sounding like throwing of the shade? This posting of yours.

Coming from my position as townie with similar frustrations earlier in the game, this is sounding somewhat townie.

Unless trent is townie and scum play along with votes, knowing last townie voter more likely won't be electing trent?

I actually never thought of the idea of scum banking on a one townie to be scrutinized for not voting. OR if scum ever felt like bussing one of their boys they could sacrifice a scum for being the one dissenting voter, as long as one of the other scum is a strong voice in investigating the sacrifice they could build their own town cred. Interesting.

At the same time I dont see where it would be fruitful for scum to even entertain an election. They would be better off stonewalling and let us keep investigating townies or use their nightkill in the case of a no-lynch.

The way the game is setup I just dont see how I could view a final election holdout as anything other than a townie move.

"4. Real Life issues and situations should and will always take priority over what happens in the game."

This means that we're allowed to step away from the game thread to do things like eat, sleep, use the toilet, go to work/school, etc. Nobody is expected to sit on top of the thread 24/7. Stop acting like there's something wrong with me stepping away from the thread for any reason as if I'm not participating enough. If you really think that there's an issue with my participation level, you need to quote Lift and tell him that you have an issue with my participation level.

However if you go re-read the thread. Not once will you see anyone saying things like, "Where is Catventurer? It's been five minutes since her last post. Where is she? Doesn't she know that she's not allowed to leave the thread for any reason? We don't care that she's been sick or that she has a special needs cat because real life doesn't matter to us."

By the way, you're offline while I write this....

I really think that you're just pegged me as the weak one and are trying to break me down - that if you push me hard enough that I'll just death spiral into despair and self-vote for no reason other than to get away from you.

Or maybe you just really want my attention for some reason.


I find it interesting that Flocke seems really determined to quite rudely keep all of my attention and not share it with anyone. Why is that?

Do you think that Flocke is just over there going "love me love me say that you love me" because I have all the cats and live in a state that really does get its name from a 16th century romance novel... or is this a desire to have me vote to eliminate Flocke. Yes, I'd like a second opinion from you. <3


Except that scum knows who all the townies are. A hold out is just as likely to be scum because they would rather we keep voting out more townies.


-------------------

I'm in Northern California, so nowhere near the LA fires. I'm nowhere near Paradise, which burned down in the Camp Fire (2018). That one was just really bad such that there literally was smoke practically everywhere in this part of NorCal. It looked like a really thick fog and made my glad my car has fog lights. Even though I went to Home Depot and got N95 masks, just the brief period that I was breathing in the smoke was enough to damage my sinuses.
[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_Fire_(2018]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_Fire_(2018[/url])

There was a grass fire last year that was about 10 minutes away from my house, which makes me really glad that a lot of that ex-farmland turned grassland is being cemented over and redeveloped into houses. It gets rid of the grassland and creates more places to live. Win! Win!

ELECTION:
Trent North 4 - mchack 269, cat 306, bucktooth 316 and self
mchack East 1 - Flocke 336
all others are self-electing.

INVESTIGATION:
mchack 1 - joppo 333
Flocke 2 - pooka 302, mchack 326
joppo 1 - trent 309
Cat 2 - bucktooth 285, Flocke 336

not voting: yogsloth, catventurer

-----------------

Since I'm looking like the only viable investigation, can we just get it over with?

I'm gonna try and mix replies to queries made after I returned with my catch up work. I think it'll make my replies more relevant after all.

I meant that just by looking at CatV's suspicion of Farky I didn't need to look any further to know his election would just not happen.
(Unless they were both scum, of course, but then I wouldn't want to see that election happen)

Here you yourself admit that you wouldn't let this plan to elect Farky work. With Trent, CatV and you it already makes three people who did not think he was Town. Are you the scumteam?
And where did you get that most people believed Farky to be Town? I saw Pooka say he leaned him Town, and bucktooth didn't say anything but I think he wasn't sure enough Farky was scum until voting him was the only way to avoid a NL. You appear to be misrepresenting things here by a large margin.

As for the Trent election, he himself gave a very good reason we shouldn't make him pope. At least while we have a lynch buffer we shouldn't elect anyone willy nilly.

===============================
Catching up:


My, my. I think we have just found someone whose pride is too big to become an adequate pope.
Silly sinfulness aside, this reads kinda LAMIST to me. "Look at me, I'm the only townie doing anything so far" doesn't sit well, despite her being one of the most active players.

So... one post after bucktooth declares that selfvotes are usually frustrated townies rather than "ultimate scum bluff" you selfvote.

Looks a bit too coincidental, if you ask me.

Alright here you address my concern above, and while it doesn't completely erase all scumpoints the selfvote gave you it's an explanation that makes sense if coming from town!CatV.
Just so you know, a couple days after I disappeared I thought I should call for a sub since my absence was going to drag the game down... except for the fact that there was no sub. So I kicked my own ass back into the game. If I wasn't going to do it for me at least I should do it for the 9 other players and the mod.

Oh I'm sorry. Since you hasn't been a player for a long while you wouldn't be expected to know our friend GR. Well, he used to play with us last few years, but for whatever reason he eventually pissed off a handful of menchild in the Gog forum (outside of the Mafia community) plus at least one Gog mod. So he was one of the main victims of downvote bots when those were a thing, he was often reported for posts that didn't always break the CoC and he collected bans, often (or maybe even all of them) undeserved.

At those times we sometimes were in the middle of a game of Mafia and suddenly GR had to be replaced, luckily he would most of the time call for a friend with a newly created account and remarkably similar playstyle (wink wink nudge nudge say no more) to replace him.

I expected to come back later that same day, scumhunt some more and decide on someone who deserved that vote. I don't remember what I did during those hours I was AFK but by the time I was free to sit in front of the PC I remember I could just lie down in the sofa, so mentally tired I was. It took me a few days to shake the dust off me and get back into gear.

Yes, I know that from your side of the screen my disappearance looks bad. Nothing I can do about that, I'll just have to work hard to leave it in the past.

And where did I state that I thought _most_ people believed Farky to be town?

nowhere, that's where!

YOU are the one misrepresenting things here by a large margin!

I don't say that anywhere in the quote you make. I did said "many" people in my original post voting you. About as many as are electing trent now. (you forgot yogs (#237) in your list, so we got yogs, pooka, joppo and bucktooth.). So that's 4 = 40% of all the player population. if that's not many then I don't know what is. (even 50% with the self elect ;)

But other than misrepresenting you are also avoiding the point. As you did before. None of this is about the election going through. It's about not even trying. If you are so sure of somebody why not elect them and call for others to do the same? best case you get it through, worst case you learn something. Only Scum have nothing to win from an election (they already know who's who) unless they try and elect one of their own. Which is way harder than just investigating townies. Which is probably why some people are saying we should only use the elect mechanic later in game. When it's easier for scum to actually get an election of one their own through.

This is the point I'm making. It is irrelevant how many people you think might have elected farky or not. It is relevant that even now, you don't want any election to happen. Which is scummy.
(also the misrepresenting and then saying I was misrepresenting. that is also scummy)


That was actually a very helpful explanation. thank you :) And also I love monty python references. Put a smile on my face :)

---

But town are? you are the only one here thinking trent scummy. Haven't heard anyone else saying that. And I haven't heard you give any evidence as to why you think that, other than some other game you played with him. That would be quite uncommon in a mafia game on third day for a scum player to have but one player who thinks them scum.
Fear, uncertainty and doubt. You are spreading it again. In my quote I said don't be the last one electing trent if you are town. All town here read it. So it's out there. In other elections with less clear reads, sure. But now? with trent? only scum won't elect him for fear of loosing the game.
So they will try and play down the usefulness of the election mechanic. They try and draw this out to the deadline and then try and mis-lynch (cat is your target) or better yet no-lynch so they can mis-lynch trent with the accuser.