Alright. I believe you that it was an unintentional merge and I won't kill you for now.

But in the tradition of Bart Simpson you will have to write:

I WILL NOT DOUBLE POST AGAIN OR I'LL GET MOD-KILLED
I WILL NOT DOUBLE POST AGAIN OR I'LL GET MOD-KILLED
I WILL NOT DOUBLE POST AGAIN OR I'LL GET MOD-KILLED

at the beginning of every post for the rest of Day 1!
(Yes, three lines. The number of thy lines shall be three. Not four and not two, unless thou addest a third. Five is right out!)

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The voice echoes again through the grove. "And another one has giv-given u.up. Yes babark, my pet. Sleep and die...die! And I'll resurrect you to a new life accor-cording to my pla-an!"

[babark, you are lurking. Your most recent post reads '2 days ago'. Please return to the game. If you can't participate, please ask for replacement.]

(and yes, I am Mod. I am allowed to double post! :-D )

Okay, this is mostly just a summary for myself to help me figure things out until now. I'm always one for open and clear information, but it seems that such can be greatly resented here with the potential to get people killed, but I don't think I've said anything here that isn't freely known by anyone who knows what dedo said and what Bookwyrm said. And if I've understood something wrong, perhaps people can then correct me.

-So we currently have 12 people here.
-One is a cult leader with the ability to recruit others into the cult.
-Another is the Deprogrammer, who can kill people if they are cultists and can remove the Cult Leader's power of recruiting people.
-There are also a tracker and vigilante, who are are both good guy roles. I could look this up online, but for this specific game, I'm assuming a tracker can investigate a person per night and be told of their role. And the vigilante is some sort of offensive role?
-There are also possibly an unknown number of cultists aside from the cult leader. This means that out of the 12, we have 3 power roles, one of which has been claimed, and 1 evil role, and an unknown number of cult members, anywhere from 0 to...I dunno, I'd say the upper limit of possibility is 3.

Now dedo's explanation, if taken at face value (without lawyering into the wording): "But since a Day 1 lynch of the Cult Leader would unbalance things, we have a measure in place to counteract that" suggests to me, in plain english that the thing being "counteracted" isn't the unbalance, rather the lynching, which leads me to believe the Cult Leader cannot be lynched today. Considering this, I'd assume we have at least one other cultist, otherwise it'd be quite unfair to have the game structured so as to have a lynch today.
Still, the idea that the lynch could somehow be "stopped" if everyone voted for the actual Cult Leader seems confusing. If everyone voted and the Cult Leader wasn't lynched, it'd raise eyebrows, and then everyone would vote the same person tomorrow. So who knows...

Some interesting ends I see:
It would take a maximum (assuming 1 leader and 1 cultist) of until the 4th morning/3rd night with no cult-kills (and no no-lynches) for the cult to overrun the rest of us and take control of voting. It would be a day less for every additional starting cultist.
Not counting anything the vigilante might do, even if we get a cultist every lynch, assuming a start with 1 Cult Leader and 1 cultist, there will always be 2 baddies. This means that if the Cult Leader can avoid getting lynched, it would until the 9th day for the cult to form half the voters. This can be reduced by a day for every additional starting cultist.

So it seems obvious that our main goal, at least after today where somehow it is not possible, would be to find out who the Cult Leader is.

What? I was active! Who says I wasn't active! It took me an entire day and a half to post that post! I started it ages ago, honest :P.

My eyes (both this time) of suspicion are on Fantasysci5 (lack of any real contribution), Ixamyakxim and docbear1975 for disseminating obvious incorrect information (they could also just have not read stuff properly, I guess).

The Tracker doesn't reveal a role, just whether or not a person "moved" (carried out an action) during the night.

As for me disseminating incorrect information - I'm assuming you're referring to my slip RE: the deprogrammer killing town as well? I quickly corrected that a few posts later (just about 10 minutes later LOL) - I went back to reread the opening posts and saw I had mucked that up.

Also - I'd say there's no way there will be a "failed lynch" - it just doesn't work in this (almost wholly open) game. I still stand by either a second cultist who becomes the leader if there's a Day One cultist lynch OR a "sleeper townie" who will become the leader. Those are just my guesses for the most elegant / simple ways to handle it. I suppose it's really neither here nor there (other than the first option pointing to a starting cult consisting of more than just the cult leader).

Oh, and welcome to the game! I was starting to wonder where you were! ;) I was starting to think dedo had replaced you LOL. "Wait, that guy's a MOD?"

awww, it's okay flub *gives hug*

How nice of you to join us!

First I'll make a general statement:

Talk about power roles really does in a lot of ways (not all of the time / it can be done so that it doesn't) benefit the scum faction / be anti-town. I'm a proponent of those with PRs almost always just being left to their own devices and hopefully they make good choices and everyone else just shuts up about what the PRs do and try to make the best of it with what they have. Wait for the PRs to either explicitly tell something or search for hints from them and try to follow their lead. (ex. I am a seer, and I of course don't want to out myself, but I have N1 information that returned in a scum result on bler that I want to share sooner rather than later because everyone is listening to him make his case on krypsyn, I've got to tell everyone not to believe bler! what do I do?! Depends of course, but if 2 other people are voting for bler with me, I might say I think 1 of them is the seer and that I didn't want to call out who and feel bad for even saying I think it is 1 of them, but that I have to stick with that thought and vote for bler too, and then use some fallable type statement like "if any of you are smart townies, you'll join me in changing your vote too!") and just hope the message gets through, or try another subtle thing or tow, and of course possibly even hint that I'm the seer.

anyway, blah blah blah...

tip:

Making statements like the one quoted above is a bad move / pro-scum (unless you do it to be misleading, but as a newer player scum is probably more likely to think it's genuine from you), because:

it shows the scum faction that you are not the PRs when you talk about them in a way that makes you seem so distant from them (again, which can be good if you are intending to be misleading) or are unaware of how they function (ex. because if you were the tracker, you'd have a better understanding of the tracker role and not have said what you said.)

However, you are a decent player enough from what I've seen, even if newer, that of course we can't rule out the possibility that you are actually a PR and did state it those ways on purpose to mislead. But anyway...

For everyone who isn't familiar with the PRs that are known to exist in a game, I strongly suggest going and reading their information on the wiki, and kind of think if you are town, not understanding the roles in the game is anti-town and I go *grrrrrr* at you!

GO! DO IT NOW! SLA...A...A...ACCK...KERRR...ER..ER... before even reading the rest of this if you haven't already!


which is why I think it starts with just the CL. That is too quick, imo. Also, assuming 1CL and 1cultist at the beginning, the odds of hitting them are so slim, it makes the game being over quicker even more likely, AND there is the vigilante role.

and the only way to do that aside from lynching people until we luckily hit the CL is to let the PRs do their thing and hope they get the job done before they get killed/converted or the cult over-runs us. Keep the pool of players as big as possible for today/tonight so we're less likely to lose PRs right away.

We've got to be patient, this doesn't mean I want to no-lynch every day, don't let other player's rhetoric about me voting no-lynch for the entire game misrepresent my no-lynch voting, it's just a tactic to devalue my vote and what it means here now toDay, of course we need to lynch at some point, and that point is probably tomorrow for me (I don't see going no-lynch on D2.)

In any game, there is always a better chance of hitting town with a lynch than hitting scum without any more information. That is no excuse to No-Lynch. And in a game where the mafia team grows, voting No-Lynch is completely unreasonable. All it's really doing is wasting a day and letting us start the game over with an extra scum.

@Bookwyrm - It wouldn't take much arm-twisting for me to join a wagon of anyone voting "No-Lynch". While my gut thinks Drealmer is probably town, it's been wrong before and especially on day 1, I have no problem lynching someone displaying what I deem as anti-town behavior.

My brain is starting to spin, and I think smoke is coming out of my ears. *Sits down and eats some strawberries *

I am beginning to believe that Bookwrym's claim that he's the deprogrammer is legit.

[i]drealmer7: Keep the pool of players as big as possible for today/tonight so we're less likely to lose PRs right away.

We've got to be patient, this doesn't mean I want to no-lynch every day, don't let other player's rhetoric about me voting no-lynch for the entire game misrepresent my no-lynch voting, it's just a tactic to devalue my vote and what it means here now toDay, of course we need to lynch at some point, and that point is probably tomorrow for me (I don't see going no-lynch on D2.)[/i]

Dessimu: We have a luxury of not being rushed into things, so voting No-Lynch seems like a valid and perfectly fine idea. For at the moment, fact is that there is 1 CL vs 3 town power roles. So lets not lynch our weapons prematurely. Add to that a fact that lynching CL day 1 may or may not result in immediate Town win as per rules.

Hmm, these arguments make a good case for a no-lynch on D1. I thought I was on my way to making up my confused mind. I need to ponder and reread some posts.

Well, you keep pushing the idea that Bookwyrm's was a false claim or at least a bad idea to claim, and that "if it is, it's puts the real Deprogrammer in a bad situation". Why? Says who? Doesn't seem to at all.
Makes no sense for a false deprogrammer claim (either from cult or from a townie), that wouldn't be caught out or removed within a day.

I also like the subtle dig at my supposed absence, when in fact you and me have spoken the exact same number of times!

Of course and of course not. Quit reducing everything to generalities, games are best taken on a case by case basis.

Nonsense! It gives our PRs more of a chance to not be killed and to do their thing and help town!

...and situations are best taken Day by Day, and even potentially moment to moment within the Days. I honestly am quite surprised there is yet another game where I am comfortable voting no-lynch on D1, but, here we are. *shrug*

SO,

fantasysci5, can you elaborate on your voting for flubbucket? do you consider no-lynch a possible option as well?

everyone else, deadline is a few days away, can you please place a vote if you haven't, and if you would also be so lovely, give a reason for why you are voting

As noted previously, one of the best things we can do is have everyone behaving and talking so that at any point we can see if their behavior shifts or if they give signs of being in the cult. Those not sharing much need to contribute something, please, and yes, I think we should all push everyone to vote. Waiting until close to deadline is bogus.

It's Day1, there's not much to go on. Pick something that seems the most valid to you to vote someone, vote for them, and tell us about it. GO! Then we will see where we are at.

It's totally understandable. That will happen regardless of your experience at times! I think you have the right approach. Sit and eat strawberries and re-read (the entire thread at this point might be a good idea, it's only 4 pages and it'll re-center you), then ponder and reflect and go with your best judgement, try not to let others influence you too much, as someone is likely just as wrong as someone else at this point, again, no matter the experience level, and the best thing to do, I think, is just do what you think is best.

wooooop...I ALMOST posted the message without waiting the full 10 minutes

EEEEP

So, I minimized and just came back.

lively bunch here, I think maybe it's the lack of nutrition in these times of stress. Docbear has the right idea, we need to get some food. I've talked enough, you all figure out what you want to do, and I'll go fix us all something to eat...

This time I want a fresh papaya please.

Your logic is greatly flawed...you claim there is a slim chance we can catch scum. If that is the case, the chance for power roles to work is also slim. The only very likely possibility is that the cult will grow in size...

No lynch is a terrible idea in any cult game...

Ok...:
- No-Lynch. Cult grows by +1. Unless the thing*.
- We lynch townie. Cult grows by +1. Unless the thing*.
- We lynch power role. Cult grows by +1. Unless the thing*.
- We lynch CL - something wonderful happens? Though likely that game won't end just yet. Cult probably doesn't grow?

*Thing includes one of these exceptions, after which cult does not grow over night:
- CL goes suicidal.
- CL targets Deprogrammer.
- CL and Deprogrammer cancel each other out.
- CL gets vig-shot down.
- CL does nuthing.

So... The way I see it, we either vote No-Lynch today and save ourselves trouble of reducing town numbers for no reason whatsoever. Or we hit the bulls-eye, lynch CL and see what happens. If you are so eager to lynch someone and you are not following the "god" yet, would you kindly point to the direction of the Mr. Cult Leader? Thank you.