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General discussionDo you use a sound card?(47 posts)(47 posts)
(47 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted August 02, 2022
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BlueMooner: For additional info, the comp I'm using I got in 2010, so it's older. I'm heading towards buying a new cpu, mobo and ram, and may start a new thread on advice, but for now I was just struck by how I didn't notice a damn thing in that sound sample. Maybe a 1% difference, but nothing remotely worth caring about. A bunch of posters in a Thief thread had remarked on the "clear" difference, confusing me.

So, I wasted a whole bunch of time reading up on openAL and DSOAL about mimicking eax via software, only to finally learn that the TFIX patch for Thief gold already allows you to enable the eax setting. All I've noticed so far is there seems to be a lot more echoing. : /

FWIW, I'm not sure exactly what speakers I have, having bought them so long ago, but going just by looks, I think it may be Logitech X-230 2.1 Channel Computer Speakers. I don't have to worry about sound bothering my roommate, but I also don't have an expensive sound system. I also never use headphones (though I've sometimes thought about getting some for when I watch politics or porn).

Would a $20 DAC add a whole lot to a two speaker/subwoofer system? I'm guessing it wouldn't.
In my understanding you have your Logitech speakers connected to the Audio Out on your MB, so you are using your onboard DAC from 12 years ago and your speakers from 18 years ago, they surely are well past their obsolescence time, not judging, just an observation.
Maybe yes with an external DAC you could tell the difference and maybe take the chance and upgrade your loudspeakers as well, you would certainly notice the difference.
As the other have already said the DAC is a key component in the chain of sound reproduction, for example I let the DAC in my receiver do the conversion and keep it hooked to my GPU, this way the signals are digital up to the receiver, with basically no interference, and are converted to analog by its DAC which I trust can do a better job than whatever consumer onboard audio/dedicated soundcard available.
Posted August 02, 2022
I have a Focusrite Scarlett 18i8 (second gen) audio interface for recording, but I don't use it for gaming. I'm really not that fussy when it comes to my own entertainment and I've never found an integrated DAC that was so bad I felt the need to use anything else.
Posted August 02, 2022
$ lspci -vvv |ag crea
06:00.0 Multimedia audio controller: Creative Labs CA0108/CA10300 [Sound Blaster Audigy Series]
Subsystem: Creative Labs SB1550 Audigy 5/Rx
Posted August 03, 2022
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paladin181: I didn't say that. 3.5mm tends to be lower quality sound, though.
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WinterSnowfall: Analog audio jacks are used throughout the music industry (and in instruments)... so... not sure what you have against them :). It's just a medium, the problem is in the logic that builds the carrier signal, and some cards do have worse analog outputs. But it's not a "3.5mm jack" problem.
Fair enough. I've had worse experience in general with them, so speaking purely from experience, I can really only go by observation. Of course, YMMV.
Posted August 03, 2022
USB sound cards are often more reliable as plug and play than the garbage soldered to the board that comes standard. Average card is about $20-30 and does not normally require a driver.

Some others can run about $250-325usb. Obviously those are better sound quality, assuming you machine is not super old.
Posted August 03, 2022
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WinterSnowfall: Why anyone would use a PCIe sound card these days is beyond me.
Most USB DACs tend only support two channels and I prefer to passthrough a PCIe sound card to my gaming VM rather than burden that VM with yet another USB device.
Posted August 03, 2022
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WinterSnowfall: Why anyone would use a PCIe sound card these days is beyond me.
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JAAHAS: Most USB DACs tend only support two channels and I prefer to passthrough a PCIe sound card to my gaming VM rather than burden that VM with yet another USB device.
If you want more than 2 channels for Dolby or DTS, you use HDMI (or SPDIF for older formats).

What other purpose would a DAC have for more than 2 output channels (=analog outputs, hence the A in DAC), other than music production or connection to a (very) old multichannel receiver?
Posted August 03, 2022
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JAAHAS: Most USB DACs tend only support two channels and I prefer to passthrough a PCIe sound card to my gaming VM rather than burden that VM with yet another USB device.
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teceem: If you want more than 2 channels for Dolby or DTS, you use HDMI (or SPDIF for older formats).

What other purpose would a DAC have for more than 2 output channels (=analog outputs, hence the A in DAC), other than music production or connection to a (very) old multichannel receiver?
I did say that I was using a VM for gaming, so I would have to take extra steps to encode the audio which is yet another waste of cycles I can simply avoid while I still have 5.1 analogue inputs in my current speaker system.
Posted August 03, 2022
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rojimboo: The EM interference from PC components was audible for sure. The hissing got worse with temperature too, it was crazy.
Thats mostly from Y protecting capacitors connected to the pc case, that use ground and may drop some potential. If the metal slot of the audiocard is touching the housing and the audio connectors aren't isolated, one gets the hissing. Just wrap the metal slot part of the audio card on the edges touching the case with some thin isolation tape.

If the magnetic field is so big in the case that it causes capacitive interference over the air then the ground cable is incorrectly installed in the house wiring. Soldering protective circuitry or fixing the ground cable are the solutions.
Post edited August 03, 2022 by Lin545
Posted August 03, 2022
Creative AE-5 here.

Before that I got an Audigy and then an X-Fi.

Back in the days I sold both to people who just had onboad and they where like O_O

I know you can do some stuff with pure software these days, but just so much.
And the moment I can throw the Creative Crystalizer , 24Bit sound and simulated 3D out (works with stereo headphones and speakers) it is night and day. I usually use neutral headphones or sound systems.
Have seen someone trying it with just software for the same output devices and it wasn't even close.

Only downside, Creative drivers can be a little tricky from time to time...


So yeah, if you don't got the most shitty output device, a soundcard will be a big difference, even today.

For simply normal stereo output, everything got closer. The moment you want more, onboard starts to fail.
Posted August 04, 2022
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BlueMooner: I only have two dinky speakers.
I don't have a sound card, but I can tell you that this bit is something you should consider upgrading. A friend of mine had a pair of Genelec speakers; they cost a ton or two (really, like 1000-2000 €, can't remember the exact model) but they were the best-sounding speakers I have heard so far.

If you're unwilling to plonk such a ridiculous amount of money on speakers (I certainly haven't done so), please let me recommend getting a good set of headphones. The great thing is that audio fundamentals remain unchanged, so second-hand devices are perfectly viable, headphones and speakers alike. I've got a Yamaha HPH-500 set, which was something like 400-450€ here when new; that's silly money as far as I'm concerned, but I bought these second-hand from our equivalent to Craigslist for 100€ plus 20€ for cup cushions that fit around my ears better. Probably the best 100€ I've spent in the past five years, plus I don't need to worry about my neighbours if I turn up the volume.
Post edited August 04, 2022 by AlKim
Posted August 04, 2022
I don't, but I did get a decent set of "shelf speakers" I use on my computer. Well-reviewed-by-many speakers that I also really like: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B016P9HJIA/

What I do have that most don't: I don't use onboard network, but do use a card. (Even though my home is only wired mixed gigabit/100mbps, it stops transfers from hammering the CPU.)

On the video you linked: I hear the difference even on my crappy old Dell business-class laptop.

EDIT: I was one of the "later" people to drop my sound card to on-board [obviously some, as seen here, still haven't]... But that's because I was hopeful for more enhanced audio technology to stick around for gaming (good positional audio, hardware-based reverberation sets, huge number of channels with mixing [the dynamic tracks of the Unreal soundtracks!] etc). Alas, that died out as everyone focused excessively on graphics and physics and left sound to develop ever so slowly, and in software, since.
Post edited August 04, 2022 by mqstout
Posted August 04, 2022
Used to use a Xonar DGX. At the time I thought it was great. I eventually upgraded to the Soundblaster Z SE, which makes it look like crap by comparison. Lately I've been using Dolby Access and DTS Headphone X. You don't need a sound card for either of these. They're about $20 each. If you can't get both, I would recommend Dolby Access. DTS has better virtual surround sound, but with some games the sound is very tinny (as in the metal). It's kind of a gamble which games do or don't have this effect. Access is more consistent IMO. Looking back I wish I just saved my money for an external DAC. It's like a sound card, but you can plug it into different devices.
Posted August 04, 2022
I use a soundblaster AE-9 with a pair of 2.0 monitors, it's a whole different ball game compared to the integrated option from my motherboard. Plus I love how crisp and clean the audio for my music and movies, gives it a bit more life.

Little downside is Games hate anything past 192khz audio rate. if you go 396 or whatever it just cuts out the audio completely. so that is something to keep in mind if you decide to go with an audiophile grade card. Max settings would be 32bit at 192khz for compatibility.
Post edited August 04, 2022 by ZocomMAX
Posted August 04, 2022
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rojimboo: The EM interference from PC components was audible for sure. The hissing got worse with temperature too, it was crazy.
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Lin545: Thats mostly from Y protecting capacitors connected to the pc case, that use ground and may drop some potential. If the metal slot of the audiocard is touching the housing and the audio connectors aren't isolated, one gets the hissing. Just wrap the metal slot part of the audio card on the edges touching the case with some thin isolation tape.

If the magnetic field is so big in the case that it causes capacitive interference over the air then the ground cable is incorrectly installed in the house wiring. Soldering protective circuitry or fixing the ground cable are the solutions.
Thanks, but you're 9 years too late. If only I had your advice back then, I would have used tape on the metal connectors of my onboard chip where they touched the casing. Because of course that would have worked. Maybe even some duct tape on top, that always does the trick.

In the meantime, I got an absurdly fabulous internal card with superb sound that gave me pleasure for all these years, still does, that not only did not suffer from the inadequacies of internal onboard audio, but it elevated my aural experience.

You get what you pay for.
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BlueMooner: I only have two dinky speakers.
I missed this part in my first reply.

There is no point in doing anything with your sound until you improve this situation. Expecting decent sound with two rinky dink Logitech speakers is um, asking a lot.

By far the most cost-effective solution would be to buy decent headphones. Then you can bundle them with a USB DAC.

The difference will be night and day.
Post edited August 04, 2022 by rojimboo
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionDo you use a sound card?(47 posts)(47 posts)
(47 posts)