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General discussionDevotion is coming to GOG on Dec. 18th!(1322 posts)(1322 posts)
(1322 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted December 18, 2020
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SumofOne: I don't know what this "gamers" are, or even if they exist BUT to me GOG and other western business shouldn't even bother with China market if they have to walk on eggshells like this all the time.
I really don't get this obsession with China. Yes they have many people but in the end you can still have a healthy business without them and if you are just constantly trying to walk on eggshells to not get on their attention or bad side then at some point they will probably ban you anyway so it is wasted effort.
If you don't get it, I'll tell you: one billion potential customers. And don't forget that GOG's mother company is CD Projekt SA, publicly traded and responsible to their shareholders who only care about money, not politics, morals or games. No company can afford to ignore opportunities of doing business in China. Capitalism is dog eat dog. And even if they'd get kicked out eventually, they're making money until that day, and have made their name known in case they can return through more official means (see Steam).
Posted December 18, 2020
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Mplath1: As I pointed out in another thread about this, I like that they pulled this little stunt and gave away Prison Architect on the same day.
Yeah, I noticed that too. "Here's your free game kids, now shut the fuck up about Devotion!".
Post edited December 18, 2020 by Dragon_Claw
Posted December 18, 2020
Very disappointing. I knew you were bad already with your support for new games, but this is really low. Just stick with your old games.
Posted December 18, 2020
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[deleted]
Post edited February 12, 2023 by lace_gardenia
Posted December 18, 2020
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LordJF: This whole thing is starting to get some mainstream media coverage as well.

https://www.theguardian.com/games/2020/dec/17/taiwanese-horror-game-pulled-from-sale-again-after-backlash-in-china
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toxicTom: Thanks!

Key quote:

Like many PC gaming firms, GOG operates in a grey area in China. The company’s service is available in simplified Chinese, and to users without a VPN. But the Chinese government technically requires games to be licensed for sale in the country – a process strictly controlled by the National Radio and Television Administration and Ministry of Culture and Tourism.

Larger games companies such as Activision Blizzard have sidestepped the requirement by partnering with Chinese firms to release their games on the mainland, while smaller storefronts like GOG have mostly been content to fly below the radar – something with the release of Devotion may have threatened.
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toxicTom: That is the explanation, GOG doesn't want to draw any attention to themselves from the Chinese watchdogs.
In that situation it was really stupid to consider selling this game, and even announce it.

That's like breaking and entering in bright red clothes and with a large bell around your neck.

Maybe we misinterpreted everything and there were real, and well-meaning gamers from China messaging GOG to warn them that they're about to be stepping in deep shit and draw the attention of the watchdogs...

"After receiving many messages from gamers, we have decided not to list the game in our store." - we don't know what those messages were, we just assumed it was angry Pooh-fans... Could also have been Chinese GOG customer who are afraid of losing access to their accounts if GOG put themselves in the spotlight of Chinese authorities.

But of course it can also have been threats: Remove the game, or we'll come check your license... or both.
There is no way for anything to fly below the radar of Chinese tracking. They got surveillance measures in place beyond Orwell's worst nightmares. Devotion shouldn't even be a source of conflict anymore. This developer removed content after what happened over at Steam.

That aside the real story can be found on Weibo ... Chinese gamers threatened to boycott CP2077 if Devotion was not removed before it was even added. They also threatened CP2077 because they found signs of promoting Taiwanese independence consciousness ... This is where things stand and this is what GoG had to say about hurting Chinese gamer's feelings when releasing Devotion on their official Weibo page: 「GOG.COM 保證不會做出傷害大家感情的事情，請大家放心」。Which roughly translates to GOG.COM promises not do anything that will hurt everyone's feelings. Please rest assured.

I still don't believe that it is gamers but official watchdogs considering the part about hurting Chinese peoples' feelings ... Reason being that I fail to see why this game, not even containing content that was causing an outrage, has been removed after what happened to this Taiwanese developer on Steam the first time there was conflict about this game. Said gamers, who first found a pirated-copy of it, thinking that some of it would satirize their national leader ..., started it and got it removed there and their publisher to drop the studio like a hot potato.

GoG bend to those gamers, they took their time to reply and reassure said gamers on their official Weibo, and all we get is radio silence. That seems to me to be the whole story. GoG seems to be sitting it out not acknowledging their actual customers here thinking that it will be forgotten in a day or a week or even a month from now.
Post edited December 18, 2020 by Mori_Yuki
Posted December 18, 2020
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lace_gardenia: yeah, white people tend to be really angry when you point out systemic racism that benefits them
You realize that your statement is racist stereotype and prejudice, right? Do you see the irony here?
Posted December 18, 2020
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lace_gardenia: yeah, white people tend to be really angry when you point out systemic racism that benefits them
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ScarletEmerald: You realize that your statement is racist stereotype and prejudice, right? Do you see the irony here?
People like her never do...
Posted December 18, 2020
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lace_gardenia: yeah, white people tend to be really angry when you point out systemic racism that benefits them
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ScarletEmerald: You realize that your statement is racist stereotype and prejudice, right? Do you see the irony here?
Also, not to point the obvious to the idiot. I'm not White. And I'm not American. I don't give a shit about the "White race" anymore than I give a shit about the "Black race". And I give even less of a shit about the little feelings of snowflake anti-semitic social-justice-warriors like BLM, Antifa and other Nazi organizations.

I was looking forward to seeing my library going into 1000+ games by next year. But China can stick their murderous anti-freedom ideas up their good-old-games. I ain't touching another product from CD Projekt until they at least take responsibility over their shitty decision and stop tucking in their balls by claiming it was due to "gamers".
Posted December 18, 2020
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Mori_Yuki: There is no way for anything to fly below the radar of Chinese tracking. They got surveillance measures in place beyond Orwell's worst nightmares.
Yeah, is it a bird, or is it a plane? As the Guardian pointed out, GOG used to be too small to care.

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Mori_Yuki: Devotion shouldn't even be a source of conflict anymore. This developer removed content after what happened over at Steam.
And still the game didn't return. Removing the content and voicing an apology is sometimes not enough. Because it doesn't alter the fact that they did mock the "leader" (and his mother) and that fact won't go away, even if they remove the "evidence". Tension between China and Taiwan have always been high, sometimes at the brink of war, and everybody is on edge. The devs burnt their publisher (also people with wives and kids, anyone ever think about those?) over a silly joke they should have known wouldn't end well in this tense climate. And now it's GOG getting burned.

GOG have by simply announcing the game maneuvered themselves in an impossible position: Publish the game, get kicked out of China (and probably suffer Chinese troll DDoS during CP77-release and a large sale), get CP77 banned over there, and explaining to their shareholders that freedom of art is more important than their money? Or give in, angering their Western customers for appeasing Chinese censorship and lack of humour?

Of course their handling of the situation was abysmal. Of all the lesser evils they picked the biggest one: blame "gamers".
Post edited December 18, 2020 by toxicTom
Posted December 18, 2020
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Whenn you lie straight up to the customer' face and say gamers got angry, but everyone knows what happended to it on Steam, it's inexcusable. If anything, I won't bother buying any game from GOG again. If you want to support this bullshit, be my guest.
Posted December 18, 2020
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CityDPRED: Lol, “fragility”, want to see some real “fragility”?
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lace_gardenia: yeah, white people tend to be really angry when you point out systemic racism that benefits them
Outstanding.

Do you have a PhD, in particular Clownery, I bet you were top of the class?

Sheesh, nobody benefits from racism.
Posted December 18, 2020
high rated
Don't know if someone already mentioned it - but on official Zoom channel one of admins mentioned, that they are willing to add Devotion to their offer (if dev will be interested), but rather not in this year, quoting (by "Zoom_Jordan"):

"if Red Candle Games wants to host Devotion here, that's fine. We're just slammed at the moment. I can reach out to them early next year and see what they say. However, we really need to catch up on our current backlog first. We need to deliver what we already have in the queue."
Posted December 18, 2020
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Mori_Yuki: There is no way for anything to fly below the radar of Chinese tracking. They got surveillance measures in place beyond Orwell's worst nightmares.
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toxicTom: Yeah, is it a bird, or is it a plane? As the Guardian pointed out, GOG used to be too small to care.

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Mori_Yuki: Devotion shouldn't even be a source of conflict anymore. This developer removed content after what happened over at Steam.
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toxicTom: And still the game didn't return. Removing the content and voicing an apology is sometimes not enough. Because it doesn't alter the fact that they did mock the "leader" (and his mother) and that fact won't go away, even if they remove the "evidence". Tension between China and Taiwan have always been high, sometimes at the brink of war, and everybody is on edge. The devs burnt their publisher (also people with wives and kids, anyone ever think about those?) over a silly joke they should have known wouldn't end well in this tense climate. And now it's GOG getting burned.

GOG have by simply announcing the game maneuvered themselves in an impossible position: Publish the game, get kicked out of China (and probably suffer Chinese troll DDoS during CP77-release and a large sale), get CP77 banned over there, and explaining to their shareholders that freedom of art is more important than their money? Or give in, angering their Western customers for appeasing Chinese censorship and lack of humour?

Of course their handling of the situation was abysmal. Of all the lesser evils they picked the biggest one: blame "gamers".
The lesson here is that corporations in this age invariably become anticapitalist via fiduciary duty: in pure free-market capitalism you're not legally obligated to seek maximum profit, and that profit is only the primary motivator rather than exclusive motivator. The only answre to this sort of thing is to get enough people to counteract the chinese numbers, so that they fail the fiduciary duty, anyway, and it becomes an example to the rest of the world (even then, that's not guaranteed to change anything). Effectively, the whole world is on it's knees before the racist, xenophobic dictatorship that is the CCP. That's why we can't call it Kung Flu.
Post edited December 18, 2020 by kohlrak
Posted December 18, 2020
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MartiusR: Don't know if someone already mentioned it - but on official Zoom channel one of admins mentioned, that they are willing to add Devotion to their offer (if dev will be interested), but rather not in this year, quoting (by "Zoom_Jordan"):

"if Red Candle Games wants to host Devotion here, that's fine. We're just slammed at the moment. I can reach out to them early next year and see what they say. However, we really need to catch up on our current backlog first. We need to deliver what we already have in the queue."
You should make a thread about it. That's some big news.
Posted December 18, 2020
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MartiusR: Don't know if someone already mentioned it - but on official Zoom channel one of admins mentioned, that they are willing to add Devotion to their offer (if dev will be interested), but rather not in this year, quoting (by "Zoom_Jordan"):

"if Red Candle Games wants to host Devotion here, that's fine. We're just slammed at the moment. I can reach out to them early next year and see what they say. However, we really need to catch up on our current backlog first. We need to deliver what we already have in the queue."
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RafaelRamus: You should make a thread about it. That's some big news.
Sure, thank you for suggestion, it's done:
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/devotion_probable_release_on_zoom_platform
Post edited December 18, 2020 by MartiusR
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionDevotion is coming to GOG on Dec. 18th!(1322 posts)(1322 posts)
(1322 posts)