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General discussioncRPGs: How do you generally create your character(s)(57 posts)(57 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted June 15, 2021
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BlueMooner: Also, while I think Might and Magic 9 is a Game That Shall Not Be Named, it did have an interesting method of development. When you start, you only get to choose from two classes: might or magic. That's it. After advancing many levels of either, you get a new choice. Mights could become warriors or rogues, and magics could become priests or wizards. Later, each class gets one final choice. Again, two choices depending on your current class, but the four total bases had eight total choices. So, as you go through the game and see how combat works, you can make a perhaps more informed choice of how to fine tune each character.
That actually sounds pretty good, and I wish more cRPGs were like that. Ie. you don't have to make crucial decisions "blind" in the beginning of the game, that you might severely regret later in the game. (I have played and finished M&M6-8 so far, yet to properly play M&M9...).

I realize now that when I started this thread, it was heavily influenced by me recently playing Infinity Engine RPGs (like Icewind Dale 2 and Planescape: Torment), and also some other RPGs where you had to make some pretty important decisions before you even begin the game. Even Dungeon Siege 2 felt like that. But not all cRPGs are necessarily like that...
Post edited June 15, 2021 by timppu
Posted June 15, 2021
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BlueMooner: Also, while I think Might and Magic 9 is a Game That Shall Not Be Named, it did have an interesting method of development. When you start, you only get to choose from two classes: might or magic. That's it. After advancing many levels of either, you get a new choice. Mights could become warriors or rogues, and magics could become priests or wizards. Later, each class gets one final choice. Again, two choices depending on your current class, but the four total bases had eight total choices. So, as you go through the game and see how combat works, you can make a perhaps more informed choice of how to fine tune each character.

It was different from just choosing druid or thief right at the start.
It does remind me of how Trials of Mana handles it. Except it's a few branches starting from base class, then a light/dark choice, and a different one much deeper into the game; culminating in for example, Dark/Light Swordsman.
Posted June 15, 2021
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timppu: I realize now that when I started this thread, it was heavily influenced by me recently playing Infinity Engine RPGs (like Icewind Dale 2 and Planescape: Torment), and also some other RPGs where you had to make some pretty important decisions before you even begin the game. Even Dungeon Siege 2 felt like that. But not all cRPGs are necessarily like that...
D&D based games are a pretty bad example of this. For example, you have to roll your stats, and once the game starts, your stats are immutable. Many early CRPGs, particularly Wizardry and Bard's Tale, but also Might and Magic starting with 2, have you roll stats at the start, but also have plenty of opportunities to increase them to the point where rolled stats don't matter in the long run, and I think I prefer it that way.

Even the early JRPGs (before that sub-genre established its modern conventions) broke away from this. In Dragon Quest 1, your stats are solely dependent on your name and level, and they grow substantially as you level up. Even Dragon Quest 3, which has random starting stats, also has (random) stat growth at level up which tends to eclipse the starting stats (start at single digit stats, but a class's good stat can easily break 100 even without being a really high level); in addition, you can farm seeds to boost stats further. Final Fantasy 1 only has you choose the class of each character; starting stats are fixed and stat growth is random. (There's still the issue of spell selection in FF1, of course.)

So, just go away from D&D and other table top RPG based games, and you'll find that stat decisions are no longer as permanent as they are in D&D based games.
Posted June 15, 2021
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BlueMooner: Also, while I think Might and Magic 9 is a Game That Shall Not Be Named, it did have an interesting method of development. When you start, you only get to choose from two classes: might or magic. That's it. After advancing many levels of either, you get a new choice. Mights could become warriors or rogues, and magics could become priests or wizards. Later, each class gets one final choice. Again, two choices depending on your current class, but the four total bases had eight total choices. So, as you go through the game and see how combat works, you can make a perhaps more informed choice of how to fine tune each character.

It was different from just choosing druid or thief right at the start.
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Darvond: It does remind me of how Trials of Mana handles it. Except it's a few branches starting from base class, then a light/dark choice, and a different one much deeper into the game; culminating in for example, Dark/Light Swordsman.
Fire Emblem: The Sacred Stones also does this sort of branched promotions. You have promotion items just like in most Fire Emblem games, but most characters have a choice of 2 different classes to promote to. (For example, a Mage could promote into a Mage Knight for better movement, or to a Sage for better magic power and a bigger spell selection.)

Fire Emblem Gaiden has one class that gets multiple promotion options, as well.
Posted June 16, 2021
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dtgreene: D&D based games are a pretty bad example of this. For example, you have to roll your stats, and once the game starts, your stats are immutable.
Those are quite old-school concepts even for D&D I'd say. I mean, I think only ToEE and IWD1 have rolling for attributes, and then NWN allows for small increases, a point every 4 level, and PS:T for a whole lot of increasing despite the old ruleset it uses.
And rolling for attributes in a CRPG is just absurd, baffles me that there was ever a time when it was considered a good idea. I mean, who won't just keep rerolling like crazy until getting a maxed or nearly-maxed char, at least in all relevant areas? It just makes creation terribly tedious and time-consuming.
Posted June 16, 2021
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Cavalary: NWN allows for small increases, a point every 4 level
That's still *way* too slow, and it still has other issues.
* One point every 4 levels just isn't enough, even if we assume a level cap of 99 and an endgame level of 60; that's only 15 points (or 24 if you reach 96-99), which isn't that much improvement when a stat can be as high as 18 at the start.
* NWN goes up to only *20*, or 40 in the final expansion as the cap; that's not even *close* to the level cap I gave above.
* Using that point to improve one of your weaker attributs means missing out on a full point to improve your stronger attributes, so this mechanic tends to encourage characters with one good stat that they focus everything into over more balanced set-ups.

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Cavalary: And rolling for attributes in a CRPG is just absurd, baffles me that there was ever a time when it was considered a good idea. I mean, who won't just keep rerolling like crazy until getting a maxed or nearly-maxed char, at least in all relevant areas? It just makes creation terribly tedious and time-consuming.
I think that mechanic might be OK if it only matters in the short term and not the long term (Bard's Tale 1, 2, and maybe 3 are good examples of this). A good roll might make the start easier, but a bad role won't ruin the character for the entire game.
Post edited June 16, 2021 by dtgreene
Posted June 16, 2021
I prefer martial supremacy and fighters tend to be favored in rpgs such that a poorly optimized fighter often works. Especially since most rpgs are not that hard to begin with. (difficulty spikes are way too common though.)

But I like to read the manual, wikis, and forum discussions to get some ideas at what I can make, and what is bad/good. I tend to avoid outright guides, especially since I have read too many NWN guides that say small races cannot be fighters. My level ten lawful neutral mace wielding halfling (crushmaster!) in Swordflight chapter two scoffs at such a notion. (Rogue 2/ Fighter 6/ Champion of Torm 2 to be fair. Rogue for tumble/umd.)

Also a fighter playthrough of Torment can be quite fun, if you have the mindset for it. I'm totally okay with not having social abilities anyway. I mean fighter, duh. (Aside: In 3x fighters should (probably) have at least thirteen int, cause combat maneuvers. What else are you going to spend feats on anyway.)
Posted June 16, 2021
i check what all stats do to not put point on useless one and restart my character after 50 hours because of a bad choice in the creation, i know some people like to learn from this but for me it's a lot of time that i prefere avoiding as much as possible.

I usualy create a fighter or a rogue, for magic i prefere a companion.
Post edited June 16, 2021 by Mugiwarah
Posted June 16, 2021

Option 1

I prefer to go in blind and since I play on Normal or sometimes Easy difficulty I rarely encounter anything bad - especially not in modern CRPGs. Playing a game by following guides or strategy guides just doesn't sound fun to me. If I can tell within 5-10 hours that I made a mistake I will simply restart the game and simply consider that training.

I usually go with a melee type character and it's hard to mess that build up too much.
Posted June 17, 2021
Step 1: The premise or creation options inspire me for an arch-type with a twist, or I want to carry over someone from another game.
Step 2: Chose stats, skills, and tools that approximate the character in my mind.
Step 3: Tweak looks and fashion until it's as close to them as can be.
Step 4: Whenever I've agency to do so, act as my character would, whether it be combat or conversation.
Post edited June 17, 2021 by MichaelD.965
Posted June 21, 2021
I usually end up taking way more time on the creation screen than I do playing the game lol.

Take the Realms of Arkania series. OMG, the sheer amount of time in spent creating a party for that first game. Only to redo it again after I realized I screwed up.

At some point, I ended up reading game guides and watching YouTube vids before actually playing the game. Or I should say replaying the game. I don't recall ever spending that much time when I played it way back when.

I think I'm getting spoiled on reading guides and watching gameplay vids these days for so many games. I don't even know how or when that happened. All I know is, back in the early days, I made the chars as best I could and played the damn game lol.

Guess the older you get, the more quirks you developed. :)
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EDIT:

Oops, I didn't actually say how I created the characters did I? lol

Ok, I'll do that the next chance I get, to edit the post. :)
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Post edited June 21, 2021 by gog2002x
Posted June 21, 2021
I summon little demons known as goblars. And let them play with the party creator for a day.
They always come up with interesting and fun to play compositions.
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussioncRPGs: How do you generally create your character(s)(57 posts)(57 posts)
(57 posts)