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General discussionBoycotting DRM and Game Censorship on GOG, 2021-2022(5216 posts) (5216 posts) 
(5216 posts) 
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This is my favourite topic
Posted March 19, 2021
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B1tF1ghter: Nontheless, to a purchase contract applies all marketing (thus consequences of for example "100%" being present at the time) and TOS present AT THAT TIME and any later changes to them don't apply to past purchases.
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B1tF1ghter: I had a quick re-read of TOS, and frankly it's hard to find any mentions of "ownership" in it at all at this point.
Iirc the TOS sounded differently some time ago.
The most significant related section I could find was 11.1 b, which honestly sounds imo like an attempt at excusing usage of any possible DRM.
On https://www.gog.com/about_gog it says:

We care about games

GOG.com is a digital distribution platform with a curated selection of games, a "you buy it, you own it" philosophy, and utmost care about customers.
If ToS say otherwise they are probably irrelevant in EU on that aspect due to consumer protection directives (incl "you dont have to read the ToS in EU") and accordingly implemented laws - link may need copy & paste due to crappy forum:
[url=http://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/bibliotheque/briefing/2013/130624/LDM_BRI(2013)130624_REV1_EN.pdf]http://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/bibliotheque/briefing/2013/130624/LDM_BRI(2013)130624_REV1_EN.pdf[/url]
Posted March 19, 2021
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B1tF1ghter: Oh REALLY?
Gee, thanks, I "SURELY" did not know /s
. . .
Too bad you are NOT the OP, nor you set the rules here.

Dear OP

if you have any issue with any of my posts from last several pages (since the conversation with Lodium started on my side) then please voice it.
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Lodium: I didnt say i was the OP
i just merly stated what i saw in the opening post
nothing more
You stated, let me quote:
"
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Lodium: Actually
The op
(...)
he didnt really ask people about opinions or questions regarding those issues
"
implying that you THINK you know what OP wants, what are his/her intentions, and what he/she allows.
Which you don't.

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Lodium: Not really suiprising that you want the the discussion now to be about my and your discussion earlier
No. Never.
I merely asked OP once if he has any issue with me discussing the things I discussed, and now I'm awaiting his/her response.
You are really mistaken in thinking that just because you are egocentric and not self aware then I surely must be too.
I am not.
Please, stop your petty attempts at picking a fight with me already.
Your accusatory attitude is cringe at best.
I constructively criticize GOG's and others' BS, meanwhile you dismiss my sayings and argumentation calling me a "troll" instead.
I think it speaks enough about your attitude in this conversation.

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B1tF1ghter: I had a quick re-read of TOS, and frankly it's hard to find any mentions of "ownership" in it at all at this point.
Iirc the TOS sounded differently some time ago.
The most significant related section I could find was 11.1 b, which honestly sounds imo like an attempt at excusing usage of any possible DRM.
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Zrevnur: On https://www.gog.com/about_gog it says:

We care about games

GOG.com is a digital distribution platform with a curated selection of games, a "you buy it, you own it" philosophy, and utmost care about customers.
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Zrevnur: If ToS say otherwise they are probably irrelevant in EU on that aspect due to consumer protection directives (incl "you dont have to read the ToS in EU") and accordingly implemented laws - link may need copy & paste due to crappy forum:
[url=http://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/bibliotheque/briefing/2013/130624/LDM_BRI(2013)130624_REV1_EN.pdf]http://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/bibliotheque/briefing/2013/130624/LDM_BRI(2013)130624_REV1_EN.pdf[/url]
Thanks ;) I knew I missed something!
Tho this should be placed in the TOS itself.
But it still falls under "marketing" / "advertisment" category so if GOG strafes outside of it it becomes "false advertising" and falls under customer protection laws.

edit: fixed one spelling mistake (in word accusatory)
Post edited March 19, 2021 by B1tF1ghter
Posted March 19, 2021
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GamezRanker: I am also sympathetic and hope this boycott gets some positive change re: GOG.....still, I am guessing if something was going to happen, it would've likely happened by now.
I had it pegged at probably 2-3 years, but perhaps as quickly as 6 months if we get really lucky.
Posted March 19, 2021
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Lodium: I didnt say i was the OP
i just merly stated what i saw in the opening post
nothing more
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B1tF1ghter: You stated, let me quote:
"
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Lodium: Actually
The op
(...)
he didnt really ask people about opinions or questions regarding those issues
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B1tF1ghter: "
implying that you THINK you know what OP wants, what are his/her intentions, and what he/she allows.
Which you don't.

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Lodium: Not really suiprising that you want the the discussion now to be about my and your discussion earlier
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B1tF1ghter: No. Never.
I merely asked OP once if he has any issue with me discussing the things I discussed, and now I'm awaiting his/her response.
You are really mistaken in thinking that just because you are egocentric and not self aware then I surely must be too.
I am not.
Please, stop your petty attempts at picking a fight with me already.
Your accusatory attitude is cringe at best.
I constructively criticize GOG's and others' BS, meanwhile you dismiss my sayings and argumentation calling me a "troll" instead.
I think it speaks enough about your attitude in this conversation.

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Zrevnur: On https://www.gog.com/about_gog it says:

If ToS say otherwise they are probably irrelevant in EU on that aspect due to consumer protection directives (incl "you dont have to read the ToS in EU") and accordingly implemented laws - link may need copy & paste due to crappy forum:
[url=http://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/bibliotheque/briefing/2013/130624/LDM_BRI(2013)130624_REV1_EN.pdf]http://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/bibliotheque/briefing/2013/130624/LDM_BRI(2013)130624_REV1_EN.pdf[/url]
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B1tF1ghter: Thanks ;) I knew I missed something!
Tho this should be placed in the TOS itself.
But it still falls under "marketing" / "advertisment" category so if GOG strafes outside of it it becomes "false advertising" and falls under customer protection laws.

edit: fixed one spelling mistake (in word accusatory)
Ofcourse im gonna call you a troll when you resort to name calling
you even insulted me pretty early in the discussion

And no
i didnt say i think or know what the OP think or wanted
Post edited March 19, 2021 by Lodium
Posted March 19, 2021
low rated
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GamezRanker: I am also sympathetic and hope this boycott gets some positive change re: GOG.....still, I am guessing if something was going to happen, it would've likely happened by now.
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Hexchild: I had it pegged at probably 2-3 years, but perhaps as quickly as 6 months if we get really lucky.
Let's all hope they actually do something as their radio silence isn't very reassuring.

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B1tF1ghter: ...
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Lodium: Ofcourse im gonna call you a troll when you resort to name calling
you even insulted me pretty early in the discussion
I don't recall but if you have an actual proof you are free to quote and I'll see what the fuss is about.

Also "of course I would"?
REALLY?
"he called me something so I will DO SO TOO"?
Very grown up.

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Lodium: And no
i didnt say i think or know what the OP think or wanted
The specific wording you used really made it seem like you heavily imply it.
Tho, of course, you are free to pretend you didn't.
I don't feel like making "no I didn't, yes you did" Star Gate style exchange.
The proof is public, and if you decide to cover it up by editing your past post it will still remain public and unedited in mine.
Grow up.
Your attitude is petty.

edit: trimmed a quote since otherwise it was doubled
Post edited March 19, 2021 by B1tF1ghter
Posted March 19, 2021
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Hexchild: I had it pegged at probably 2-3 years, but perhaps as quickly as 6 months if we get really lucky.
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B1tF1ghter: Let's all hope they actually do something as their radio silence isn't very reassuring.

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Lodium: Ofcourse im gonna call you a troll when you resort to name calling
you even insulted me pretty early in the discussion
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B1tF1ghter: I don't recall but if you have an actual proof you are free to quote and I'll see what the fuss is about.

Also "of course I would"?
REALLY?
"he called me something so I will DO SO TOO"?
Very grown up.

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Lodium: And no
i didnt say i think or know what the OP think or wanted
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B1tF1ghter: The specific wording you used really made it seem like you heavily imply it.
Tho, of course, you are free to pretend you didn't.
I don't feel like making "no I didn't, yes you did" Star Gate style exchange.
The proof is public, and if you decide to cover it up by editing your past post it will still remain public and unedited in mine.
Grow up.
Your attitude is petty.

edit: trimmed a quote since otherwise it was doubled
I dont know why i even bothered
i cant be arsed annymore
Not going to play the quoting game from earlier posts way back
Going to bed
Post edited March 19, 2021 by Lodium
Posted March 19, 2021
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B1tF1ghter: Excuse me, this thread is not only about Devotion.
And I was clearly addressing one of the points of this boycott (DRM).
I didn't say to get back to talking about just devotion, but rather all the topics at hand.

I was more talking about how you(and maybe 1 other) are doing so......you(and maybe 1 other) seem to be turning this thread somewhat into a place to show how right/"right" y'all are and how wrong/"wrong" the other person being replied to is, more so than just discussing the topics without doing such(so much).

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B1tF1ghter: Not every boycott is fast.
True, but at some point "the writing becomes visible on the wall for all to see", and at that point people can choose to either keep with it or not.

(I myself find it better to try to be more realistic about the odds of a movement's success, and if it seems such a thing isn't going anywhere I move on...though I still will usually hold out some hope for it to succeed anyways, even in such cases)

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B1tF1ghter: Btw, I kept my responses least extensible possible (don't misunderstand, that doesn't mean they are short, it just means I intentionally drove them shorter). I am in no way responsible for the other person RAW QUOTING (and thus OBLITERATING pages' space NEEDLESSLY) as well as trying to pick a personal fight with me just because I was comprehensively overturning leaps in logic of that other person.
I am guessing that the other user might be replying in such a manner because your tone/wording/etc comes off as a bit rude to them**.

In essence, some of your posts to them/others come off as you trying to show off how right/"right" you are and how wrong/"wrong" others you reply to are, more than discussing the topics being discussed as is without so much of such.

(**of course, again, I am not condoning other people replying rudely back to you or anyone else....i'm just saying that the way you reply might be part of why they're replying in such a manner to you...essentially people often don't like being "talked down to" like they're dumb/etc to such a degree)

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B1tF1ghter: There is only ONE ultimate truth.
It's not my problem that some people decide to negate reality and call people trolls when given proper argumentation for something.
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B1tF1ghter: Oh REALLY?
Gee, thanks, I "SURELY" did not know /s
. . .
Too bad you are NOT the OP, nor you set the rules here.
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B1tF1ghter: implying that you THINK you know what OP wants, what are his/her intentions, and what he/she allows. Which you don't.
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B1tF1ghter: You are really mistaken in thinking that just because you are egocentric and not self aware then I surely must be too.
I am not.
Please, stop your petty attempts at picking a fight with me already.
Your accusatory attitude is cringe at best.
I constructively criticize GOG's and others' BS, meanwhile you dismiss my sayings and argumentation calling me a "troll" instead.
I think it speaks enough about your attitude in this conversation.
See the above quotes by yourself.

You seem to be taking what others(mainly Lodium, from what i've seen) say a bit too personally and seem to be trying to prove yourself more right/better than them more so than just discussing the topics in the thread without doing such.

This is a good part of what I(and likely others, going by some replies of other users) are starting to become a bit exasperated at.

-

In conclusion: this constant back/forth and name calling between you and Lodium is starting to derail the thread and turn it into a bit of a dumpster fire.

Could we maybe get back to just discussing the topics without such things so that people don't leave as a result and to make sure it doesn't get locked?

=-=-=

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Lodium: Of course im gonna call you a troll when you resort to name calling
you even insulted me pretty early in the discussion
It takes two to tango, as the saying goes....I think the best thing is for both of ya to ignore each other a bit in this thread....just my two cents/advice/humble suggestion.
Post edited March 19, 2021 by GamezRanker
Posted March 19, 2021
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Hexchild: I had it pegged at probably 2-3 years, but perhaps as quickly as 6 months if we get really lucky.
For a reference: the GOG DLer has been gone a year and GOG(beyond a few PR style replies on the matter) hasn't responded to the movement to bring it back yet(of course it has around 1/4 to 1/3 the wishlist votes and thread posts that this one does).
Post edited March 19, 2021 by GamezRanker
Posted March 19, 2021
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GamezRanker: ...
You greatly misunderstand my intentions and at this point I am not sure if it's even worth outlining them as many people will stick to what they CHOOSE to believe anyway.

Your accusations directed towards me are incorrect.
Unfortunatelly I don't think I want to dwelve into defending myself here anymore as many choose to ignore what I'm saying and instead create their twisted theories instead.
I have nothing personal against you. But please stop making up stuff. You are ASSUMING you understand my intentions. Unfortunatelly it's evident you don't.

If you are discussing something with 2 opposite points of view there is no such thing as both sides being fully right.
There is also no worldline in which everybody is right.
I can only speak for myself, but I have no problem with admitting my mistakes. But there is only one reality and only one ultiamte truth for everything. Unfortuantelly I have encountered here some people offended by facts and dismissing reality when it gets too inconvenient for them to bear it.
Perhaps you cannot see it but I merely made an attempt at fixing someone's twisted unreal point of view.

You're basically saying "keep discussing as long as it's convenient, opinions don't clash too much, the discussion is so calm it's apathic, and not too controversial things are brought up".
Sorry, but I don't care about ones feelings nor controversy, I only care about truth and preventing mass public from getting wrong ideas from someone's twisted thinking.
That's why I engaged in related discussion in the first place. Because there are guaranteed people who will come here who may read the other person's false ideas without knowing any better, and forming their own personal views based on that.
If you cannot see that, that's ok, but don't accuse me of trying to prove who is "more right" because that never was and never will be my intention here.
I'm sorry, but there is no way in which thread such as this can be "convenient" and "non-disturbing" for EVERYBODY.
There will ALWAYS be someone who will get something personally or not like something.
Stop trying to shut me up.
I am doing my close-to-best to remain highly professional and remain within argumentation without resorting to "you are stupid" like the other party is indirectly saying to me.

Name calling?
This is BS.
When you accuse me of something at least TRY to prove it. Otherwise these are just empty words.
Iirc I called the other party only 1 thing in the entire conversation and it was specificly "raw quoter" (as in raw quoting person). Which wasn't even name calling per se. I just pointed out that person's ACTUAL attitude - he/she was asked by me at least few times to stop doing that as it is highly pointless while taking up too much space thus hurting thread's readability - the person completely ignored my calls for that, so I joked a few times about it. But that was about it. I don't recall calling that person anything else.
Meanwhile that person called me:
- a troll
- a "Stem advocate"
also accused me (falsely) of bragging.
Also the person is trying to enforce his/her personal rules here even tho the thread isn't theirs (the whole "OP didn't ask for this" baseless BS).

I don't know if you were paying attention to what I was saying but I picked this specific conversation specificly because the other party started talking some nonsense about DRM that could affect "not knowing any better" people's judgement.

At this point I am fed up with this BS and some people calling me out on ARGUMENTATION (versus ACTUAL ungrown behaviours of the other party, like name calling, and plenty of easily proven wrong accusations) as well as trying to crucify me for CONSTRUCTIVE DISCUSSION.
Sorry. But if you (anybody) don't like it then you don't have to respond. This is free speech thread with many ongoing sub-conversations. You can respond to others at your own pace while ignoring my sub-conversation.
Just don't ridicule me for being constructive and in-depth.
Also, the space/length argument is so biased and petty it's not even funny.
I personally made sure to keep my post length in check. I trimmed the quotes to absolute minimum to not extend to several-length posts. Meanwhile the other party abused quoting and took up space needlessly.
Mass downvoting me JUST BECAUSE MY POSTS HAPPEN TO BE IN-DEPTH therefore LONG is exceptionally petty and ungrown in particular.

You accuse me of trying to prove who is "more right".
The truth is I and the other party aren't on the same page, not even in the same book, so there is no "who is MORE right", it's about who is right at all.
Also, I don't see what's so wrong with discussing things.
Also how apparently some people take issue with ME personally but NOT THE OTHER PERSON who clearly has done some wrong things that I have not done.

This is BS.
You people attack me for no reason while the only thing I have done was an attempt at fair and square discussion while the other conversation participant does close to nothing but escalation attempts :(
I provided argumentation, it was ingored and instead I was called troll.
I provided examples of my attempts of improving platforms as well as actual sources of my info, I was accused of bragging and "advocating platform".
If you cannot see what's going on here and you are trying to put me in the same behaviour bag with the other person then it's just sad and brutal :(
Posted March 19, 2021
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B1tF1ghter: You greatly misunderstand my intentions and at this point I am not sure if it's even worth outlining them as many people will stick to what they CHOOSE to believe anyway.
Regardless if your intentions are good or not, things like your wording/tone and your back and forth with/focusing on some users are starting to derail the thread.

I don't want to do so, but this sort of posting is starting to mess up/derail the thread, and if it continues I feel I will have to report it.

So I am asking you as a fellow gogger(and even a friend?) to please try to stick to discussing the topics at hand in a more civil manner....if not for any of us, then at least for the sake of the thread.

(Sidenote: I more or less also asked Lodium to drop this as well, so i'm not just focusing on you)
Post edited March 19, 2021 by GamezRanker
Posted March 19, 2021
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Lodium:
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B1tF1ghter: You greatly misunderstand my intentions and at this point I am not sure if it's even worth outlining them as many people will stick to what they CHOOSE to believe anyway.
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GamezRanker: Regardless if your intentions are good or not, things like your wording/tone and your back and forth with/focusing on some users are starting to derail the thread.

I don't want to do so, but this sort of posting is starting to mess up/derail the thread, and if it continues I feel I will have to report it.

So I am asking you as a fellow gogger(and even a friend?) to please try to stick to discussing the topics at hand in a more civil manner....if not for any of us, then at least for the sake of the thread.

(Sidenote: I more or less also asked Lodium to drop this as well, so i'm not just focusing on you)
I agree.You two have been going at it for several pages now and it is starting to derail the thread. Perhaps it is time to shake hands and 'agree to disagree'? Please keep it on-topic.

Also, if you are going to reply to someone, please refrain from quoting the entirety of very long posts (to keep things manageable).
Posted March 20, 2021
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GamezRanker: Regardless if your intentions are good or not, things like your wording/tone and your back and forth with/focusing on some users are starting to derail the thread.

I don't want to do so, but this sort of posting is starting to mess up/derail the thread, and if it continues I feel I will have to report it.

So I am asking you as a fellow gogger(and even a friend?) to please try to stick to discussing the topics at hand in a more civil manner....if not for any of us, then at least for the sake of the thread.

(Sidenote: I more or less also asked Lodium to drop this as well, so i'm not just focusing on you)
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Time4Tea: I agree.You two have been going at it for several pages now and it is starting to derail the thread. Perhaps it is time to shake hands and 'agree to disagree'? Please keep it on-topic.

Also, if you are going to reply to someone, please refrain from quoting the entirety of very long posts (to keep things manageable).
You can write me in the sympatic list of the cause
I wont boycott because of reasons i already tried to explain earlier.
I hope the boycott is succesfull in it results

And i Also apologize for my involvement in deraling the thread
Post edited March 20, 2021 by Lodium
Posted March 20, 2021
Well after months of no purchases at all, I did find two must-haves. As I mentioned much much earlier in this topic (before some of your wall of text bickering with each other :p I joke, I joke), my stance of boycotting is that I was only going to go for "must-have" titles to own them (meaning to have the DRM-free offline installers that GOG obscures out of view and seems to direct people away from).

I have to say I felt a little "dirty" (I guess?) making the purchase. Made sure to buy on sale so that GOG received less money, whereas in the past I would buy games at full price without hesitation to support DRM-free gaming as a whole. "Fortunately" I don't have a feeling other must-haves are coming any time soon. I could be wrong. And if GOG gets a Final Fantasy, Resident Evil, GTA, etc, I would again make a purchase.

Get on it, GOG. That's the direction. DRM-free versions of big releases. That is the crystallization of the appeal of your store. Not making "the client to end all clients" so we can buy DRMed games here too. There are enough DRMed stores, thank you very much.
Posted March 20, 2021
After GOG ignored a forum citing our problems with the storefront www.gog.com/wishlist/site/tell_the_gog_team_we_arent_appreciating_their_work_anymore and ignored the many messages from people wanting devotion www.gog.com/wishlist/games/devotion I can't see myself buying games from GOG this year. Add me to the list. I have not brought a game from GOG since Cyberpunk 2077 last year anyway so might as well make it official. In the wise words from the future ruler of earth (Doomcock) "Without respect we reject"
Posted March 20, 2021
I don't know if it was reported it already here and I apologize if I'm repeating something already known, but I've read on the community wishlist that Devotion is now available, DRM-Free, for purchase directly from Red Candle Games' website.
If you want to support the developer, I strongly suggest to buy their games directly from them: https://shop.redcandlegames.com/
Post edited March 20, 2021 by Shendue
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionBoycotting DRM and Game Censorship on GOG, 2021-2022(5216 posts) (5216 posts) 
(5216 posts)