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darthspudius: There's this thing called physical media. Very impressive new feature in films and music. They put the item on this round disc and you get to own it.
Until they decide to try to implement some new feature where the movie tries to connect to the net using your TV to find out if your disc is burned or not, and if it is it refuses to play.
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TRMG: Also, I heard there are ways to circumvent DRM on DVD's and CD's to copy their contents but I'd rather not do that since from what I gather that is still considered illegal (at least in the EU), even tough I think it's bonkers...
I think you may need to take a closer look at how local laws are being enforced in practise. In most countries it's obviously illegal to rip a DVD and upload it for others who don't own it to watch, and you could obviously be chased by the law for piracy. But in a practical sense, most countries law enforcement doesn't care about stuff like watching a DVD you legally own locally on a bedroom computer / laptop vs living room DVD player, ripping it to a tablet for the kids to watch in the back of the car, or perhaps a NAS / HTPC to watch in your living room as long as you legally bought (and keep) the original discs.

As for "it's illegal in the EU", Hollywood actually lost that argument in court in the "MPAA vs Jon Johansen" case in Norway (he was the man who created the decryption software that allowed DVD ripping):-

"The defense argued that no illegal access was obtained to anyone else's information, since Johansen owned the DVDs himself. They also argued that it is legal under Norwegian law to make copies of such data for personal use. The verdict was announced on 7 January 2003, acquitting Johansen of all charges."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_Lech_Johansen#The_DeCSS_prosecution

After losing the lawsuit on the grounds "he bought it, he can do what he wants with it for personal use, excluding pirating it for others", Hollywood re-focussed on people actually obtaining the film illegally. People ripping their own legal discs is now virtually the same "non-crime" as putting a CD onto an MP3 player / smartphone to go jogging or for the gym. In many countries such "format shifting" is fair use (so is backing up old PC games that originally came on floppy disc then playing them 20 years later from a HDD), isn't classed as piracy / copyright infringement (and certainly doesn't stand up in court as such, or is remotely worth any financial cost of bringing it to court in the first place) and as long as you don't upload anything to the Internet or share it with others, watching a DVD you legally own on a computer without the disc inserted each time is neither detectable nor likely to be practically enforceable as long as you keep the discs.
Post edited July 07, 2018 by AB2012
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Linko90: As for DRM-movies, there's a bunch in the public domain like Night of the Living Dead.
I think it depends on the country you are living in. It can be public domain in the USA, but not in an european country. If I'm wrong, someone might correct me.
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Linko90: As for DRM-movies, there's a bunch in the public domain like Night of the Living Dead.
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john_hatcher: I think it depends on the country you are living in. It can be public domain in the USA, but not in an european country. If I'm wrong, someone might correct me.
Can't comment on the mentioned movie, but otherwise you are correct. The length and other conditions of copyright vary from country to country.

You can see this if you try to download "The Case-Book of Sherlock Holmes", which is possible in some countries and not possible in others.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Case-Book_of_Sherlock_Holmes#Copyright_history_and_challenges

"The copyrights for Doyle's Sherlock Holmes stories expired in 1980 in Canada and in 2000 in the United Kingdom. In the United States, the only Sherlock Holmes works by Doyle still protected by copyrights are ten of the twelve short stories from The Case Book. The first two stories ("The Adventure of the Mazarin Stone", 1921, and "The Problem of Thor Bridge", 1922) are already in the public domain since they were published before 1923. The other stories will enter the public domain on 1 January of the year after the 95th anniversary of each story's publication: 1 January 2019 for "The Adventure of the Creeping Man"; 1 January 2020 for "The Adventure of the Sussex Vampire", "The Adventure of the Three Garridebs" and "The Adventure of the Illustrious Client"; 1 January 2022 for "The Adventure of the Three Gables", "The Adventure of the Blanched Soldier", "The Adventure of the Lion's Mane" and "The Adventure of the Retired Colourman"; 1 January 2023 for "The Adventure of the Veiled Lodger" and "The Adventure of Shoscombe Old Place"."


As far as movies go, the source material itself may become public domain, but restorations and corrections by some party may have their own protections.

Still remaining in the Sherlock Holmes topic, some Basil Rathbone movies are available as public domain versions. However, the versions restored by UCLA Film & Television Archive are not public domain.
So anyone who wants to get the best version available has to buy a physical format to view them.
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TRMG: I saw that my only options of buying a movie were "rent" (stream the movie once; can't download .mp4) and ""buy"" (stream the movie multiple times; can't download .mp4)

If it helps, these are the movies I want to watch:
Sherlock Holmes (the BBC TV show)
Anomalisa
Little Miss Sunshine
The Grand Budapest Hottel
Her
Well, there is always the good old option of buying physical media (DVD/BluRay).

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Sherlock-1-3-DVD-Benedict-Cumberbatch/dp/B00DSJYERA/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1530983799&sr=8-4&keywords=sherlock+holmes+dvd

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Anomalisa-DVD-David-Thewlis/dp/B01C36S5N2/ref=sr_1_1?s=dvd&ie=UTF8&qid=1530983852&sr=1-1&keywords=Anomalisa

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Little-Miss-Sunshine-Abigail-Breslin/dp/B000JU9OJ4/ref=sr_1_1?s=dvd&ie=UTF8&qid=1530983877&sr=1-1&keywords=Little+Miss+Sunshine


https://www.amazon.co.uk/Grand-Budapest-Hotel-DVD/dp/B00IONUN34/ref=sr_1_1?s=dvd&ie=UTF8&qid=1530983900&sr=1-1&keywords=the+grand+budapest+hotel

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Her-DVD-Joaquin-Phoenix/dp/B00ITO0NIS/ref=sr_1_1?s=dvd&ie=UTF8&qid=1530983916&sr=1-1&keywords=her
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TRMG: Also, I heard there are ways to circumvent DRM on DVD's and CD's to copy their contents but I'd rather not do that since from what I gather that is still considered illegal (at least in the EU), even tough I think it's bonkers...
Regarding this part, there's existing law to deal with making private copies of media. It's also called format-shifting, but it's easier to find the actual source material if you go looking for private copying.

Anyway, the brief version is this - in the EU, member states other than the UK which have a levy on electronic media devices already pay into a national fund to offset the damages done by private copying. This is explicitly done because there is explicit law saying people are allowed to format shift, or make private copies, of media they own. So if you buy a DVD and rip it to keep on devices you own and watch just for yourself and your family, then that's legal.

The specific details bounce back and forth a little, but in general, you're fine to make private copies of DVDs that you own.

https://www.bristows.com/assets/pdf/The%20private%20copying%20exception%20and%20jurisdictional%20issues.pdf
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OneFiercePuppy: Anyway, the brief version is this - in the EU, member states other than the UK which have a levy on electronic media devices already pay into a national fund to offset the damages done by private copying. This is explicitly done because there is explicit law saying people are allowed to format shift, or make private copies, of media they own.
Yes...


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OneFiercePuppy: So if you buy a DVD and rip it to keep on devices you own and watch just for yourself and your family, then that's legal.

The specific details bounce back and forth a little, but in general, you're fine to make private copies of DVDs that you own.
...but no. You are allowed to make a few copies and backups, and even give those to your friends, which may be surprising, but still legal.
However, you ARE NOT allowed to break any copy protection systems that may be in place, even if you have a legal copy of that.

So basically making a copy of an unprotected disc is OK, but any form of protection on the disc makes this illegal.

In the case of Blu-ray, for instance, this means that 99% of all released discs ever are illegal to copy.
On the other hand, each and every LP ever made should be completely legal to make copies of.
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OneFiercePuppy: So if you buy a DVD and rip it to keep on devices you own and watch just for yourself and your family, then that's legal.
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PixelBoy: However, you ARE NOT allowed to break any copy protection systems that may be in place, even if you have a legal copy of that.
Would a screen recorder (eg. Fraps) count as breaking copy protection?
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PixelBoy: However, you ARE NOT allowed to break any copy protection systems that may be in place, even if you have a legal copy of that.
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TRMG: Would a screen recorder (eg. Fraps) count as breaking copy protection?
Yes, it doesn't matter how you're by-passing the protection, only that you're doing it.

EDIT: Of course, only if there is some kind of protection on what you're copying.
Post edited July 07, 2018 by Maighstir
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TRMG: Would a screen recorder (eg. Fraps) count as breaking copy protection?
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Maighstir: Yes, it doesn't matter how you're by-passing the protection, only that you're doing it.

EDIT: Of course, only if there is some kind of protection on what you're copying.
I see... I thought that since the disk wasn't tampered with, it wouldn't count...

Thanks for the help!
At least in Germany the law is worded that it is illegal to bypass an "effective" copy protection. If however you use a commonly available program to rip your disks... you can always claim you simply didn't know. The actual "crime" is tied to intend and this may be hard to prove.

Also (in Germany) since it's legal to give copies to a number of friends and even download stuff (except from an "obviously illegal source") you could always claim you got your ripped copy from "someone". So the legal situation is that it's illegal to make a copy bypassing "effective" copy protection, but giving this copy to a few friends is not, and also not for them to accept it.
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toxicTom: At least in Germany the law is worded that it is illegal to bypass an "effective" copy protection. If however you use a commonly available program to rip your disks... you can always claim you simply didn't know. The actual "crime" is tied to intend and this may be hard to prove.
I don't think that the intent is necessary. There is a saying which I think is applicable here as well "Unwissenheit schützt vor Strafe nicht". Or do you have the part of the law which states otherwise?
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john_hatcher: I don't think that the intent is necessary. There is a saying which I think is applicable here as well "Unwissenheit schützt vor Strafe nicht". Or do you have the part of the law which states otherwise?
No, but if you "unintentionally" break the copy protection, it's simply not "effective".
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john_hatcher: I don't think that the intent is necessary. There is a saying which I think is applicable here as well "Unwissenheit schützt vor Strafe nicht". Or do you have the part of the law which states otherwise?
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toxicTom: No, but if you "unintentionally" break the copy protection, it's simply not "effective".
How can you unintentionally break the copy protection? Even if that is the case, would you want to defend yourself against a big corporation infront of a court? Well, I don‘t.
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john_hatcher: How can you unintentionally break the copy protection? Even if that is the case, would you want to defend yourself against a big corporation infront of a court? Well, I don‘t.
You'd be surprised how badly programmed these sorts of things can be.