It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
avatar
Azhdar: How do you resist buying your wishlisted games from DRM stores? For example, you really like a game and only Steam sells it. And developer-publisher does not release it on GOG or as DRM-free. So how do you deal with it?
I'm stronger that an addiction impulse emotional and irrational buy/play. There's no videogame that I can't easily abandon.
After all these are all just puny videogames, trying to steal me away from my realife, where the real nice juice usually happen, not in some virtual weirdo place.
Unfortunately most people are weak weaklings and the devs/publishers bet heavy on this with their DRMinfestedCrap.
avatar
amok: I refuse to let DRM stop me from enjoying my games

Strict enough?
avatar
MrPopo: This is what is generally known as the "sane" stance.
haha try explaining that to people here.
avatar
MrPopo: This is what is generally known as the "sane" stance.
avatar
Mr.Caine: haha try explaining that to people here.
Everyone has different priorities. :P
avatar
mobutu: I'm stronger that an addiction impulse emotional and irrational buy/play. There's no videogame that I can't easily abandon.
After all these are all just puny videogames, trying to steal me away from my realife, where the real nice juice usually happen, not in some virtual weirdo place.
Unfortunately most people are weak weaklings and the devs/publishers bet heavy on this with their DRMinfestedCrap.
I agree with "addiction" and "impulse buying" part. But many people don't really care about DRM, or even don't know what DRM is.
avatar
omega64: It has for me both with Uplay and Origin.
I've played Far Cry 3 Blood Dragon once, doesn't even start anymore.
Yeah, same goes for me with Uplay games luckily i bought the game while discount so i didn't lost too much and i think it's the only DRM i avoid of these day.

Other DRM worked just fine to me such a Steam, Origin & Blizzard.
avatar
vicklemos: I bought DLC once, pal. I'll say now that I don't even remember what it was, honestly ;(
I'm against bad practices, day 1 dlc or not! :)
avatar
Darvond: I cancelled my purchase of Scribblenauts Remix due to the fact that you had to buy avatars and levels. o:
QUÉ?
Really? I'm impressed and, at the same time, sad. It's such a landmark of a game and its sequel don't deserve this.
avatar
Azhdar: How do you resist buying your wishlisted games from DRM stores? For example, you really like a game and only Steam sells it. And developer-publisher does not release it on GOG or as DRM-free. So how do you deal with it?
Waiting for DRM-free Skyrim for about 5 years and counting. I would very much like to lay my hands on it - last thing I played and enjoyed from Bethesda was Oblivion. Not completely clean (but not piracy either, I just borrowed legal disc which I believe is also legal here). I had an offer to borrow Steam account too for Skyrim, but... just not worth it to install their client.

The weird thing is I don't mind using Galaxy on my computer. I guess it's about good PR. Steam representatives may talk against DRM ocasionally, but at the same time they don't mind providing tools to easily add one to games should the dev choose to. Which makes them... not exactly an enemy, but weakling who happily serves the enemy. As long as there is good (not-entirely-old) alternative, I don't see a reason to have a Steam account.
On one of my computers, the non-free BIOS as been removed and libreboot is used instead.
This computer run a GNU/Linux Debian Jessie with only free software, barring an exception: non-free games. But of course DRM-free games!

Is an anti-DRM policy that goes farther than just video games strict enough for this thread? ;)
low rated
avatar
vv221: On one of my computers, the non-free BIOS as been removed and libreboot is used instead.
This computer run a GNU/Linux Debian Jessie with only free software, barring an exception: non-free games. But of course DRM-free games!

Is an anti-DRM policy that goes farther than just video games strict enough for this thread? ;)
Will you buy DRM-free games that have had DRM-encumbered releases elsewhere? If the answer is "yes" then it is perhaps not quite strict enough.

On the other hand, it sounds like you have a mostly strict policy about non-free (FSF definition) software; you just need to get rid of the non-free games and you have a totally free machine! (Well, almost; there are still issues like CPU microcode which don't have solutions on currently available machines.)
avatar
dtgreene: Will you buy DRM-free games that have had DRM-encumbered releases elsewhere?
Yes ;)

avatar
dtgreene: you just need to get rid of the non-free games and you have a totally free machine!
No way! Alpha Centauri will *never* get uninstalled from any of my computers!

avatar
dtgreene: there are still issues like CPU microcode which don't have solutions on currently available machines.
https://libreboot.org/faq/#microcode
low rated
avatar
dtgreene: For me:
* I will not buy anything with DRM
* I will not buy anything from a store that provides its own DRM
* I will buy DRM-free games when there exists a superior DRM-encumbered version
* I will buy DRM-free games when there exists an equivalent DRM-encumbered version

Is there anyone here that is more strict than me?
Well, yes and no.

In asking the DRM question, you always end up "defining" DRM, and I'd like to skip that.

I strongly dislike copy protection mechanisms, and that encompasses a whole lot more than just DRM. When a developer shoehorns online multiplayer into his singleplayer game, that effectively acts as a copy protection mechanism. Online sharing, online swapping, achievements etc., all that ties your personal online profile in with the game you bought. So that's irksome to me even though hardly anyone would call it "DRM".

So that's where I'm definitely stricter.

Then again, I e.g. accept disc or module based DRM i.e. the DRM of certain console manufacturers that still communicate a certain possession when you buy their games. It's a clear cut, invasive form of DRM that I just plain accept from developers and publishers.

So that's where I'm definitely less strict.

A lot of it comes down to trying not to support a monopoly, and to somehow still protect your privacy when companies start to think it's all public domain, and all fair game. DRM is strictly speaking just a symptom of the problem.

If Steam gave up all forms of DRM and only offered unprotected .exe files tomorrow, I still wouldn't buy from Steam. In fact, if they could just do that without even asking their business clients (they didn't ask their business clients about radically changing their return policy too), it would exemplify the problem. :|
avatar
dtgreene: In particular, is there anyone here who will refuse to buy any game that happens to be available on Steam, even if it is available elsewhere DRM-free?
Okay, that IS an interesting stance. But with it, you end up boycotting developers that support DRM-free games, and that at a time when some devs only just begin to re-understand that there's actually a way to distribute games that doesn't involve Valve or their loyal vassal steam key reseller Humble Inc.

Let's go for an even stricter variation:
If you're indifferent to DRM in principle, but favor DRM free, but still don't wish to support the monopoly for its transformative (if not eventually inevitably destructive) influence on the PC games market, should you buy a game from Humble that comes with a separate DRM free version if you inevitably get an additional Steam key with it, even when you know for a fact that Valve will not get any money out of that deal?

Bonus question: If you hoard that Steam key and never use it, are you still somehow supporting the monopoly's reach and influence? If you give that Steam key to somebody else, are you still supporting the monopoly's reach and eventually revenue?
Post edited April 29, 2016 by Vainamoinen
avatar
mystikmind2000: The bottom line is this..... if everyone simply refused to buy the first games to come out with more unreasonable DRM elements, then it would have died out there and then.

Because when it comes to DRM, If you accept it, what you do is encourage more of it.
avatar
dtgreene: What would you say about this argument:

By buying games that are sold with DRM, you are encouraging the use of it, even if the particular copy of the game you want doesn't have the DRM. Do you agree with this stance, or do you think it is flawed?
Yes and no. If the publisher takes the time to evaluate sales of DRM versus DRM-free stores, maybe they will understand the difference. And maybe not. But I think that requires same day releases to make a fair comparison, else the lion's share of sales might go to one version and the other version gets just the left-over trickle. Further, it would be helpful for the customers to contact the publishers and let them know "Without the DRM-free option, I would not have purchased this title. Thanks." Which, admittedly, I have not done and probably should.
avatar
DreamedArtist: But gimp man... that interface and ugh I don't want to sound like a bitch but god damn it's annoying and does not offer the experience that adobe does.. or maybe that is cause I used photoshop all my life and moving to something else is almost impossible for me :/
It's likely the latter. Photoshop (the full version) is a more advanced program in a number of ways, inclduing UI and usability, compared to Gimp, but only if you actually depend on those advantages. Most hobbiest / amateur users don't, really. I find Darktable (only available on Linux) to be far superior to Lightroom and in that case that does include the UI - and as I have a new Laptop that still runs the Windows it came with a case to directly compare. Likwise Illustrator is good. On both ends Affinity's alternatives are pretty powerful. Not quite there yet, but very nearly - and about to see a Windows release, too.

For me, at the moment, only Adobe Premiere for Video editing really still stands out. There's professional alternatives to it, of course, but Premiere's gotten rapidly better recently; and quite likely due to Adobe being the company that tries to gain market share, on that end.

What Adobe has, much as Word, is market share. The moment you collaborate with others is when it matters. Otherwise ... do look around a bit and try alternatives.
Post edited April 29, 2016 by Mnemon
avatar
mystikmind2000: The bottom line is this..... if everyone simply refused to buy the first games to come out with more unreasonable DRM elements, then it would have died out there and then.
Actually, we can go back a step. If no one had ever bothered to pirate a game, then there would never have been DRM. I completely understand companies desire to have DRM on their games - pirates suck. The only problem is, DRM hasn't yet done anything to prevent piracy.
People still actually buy into DRM?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX7wtNOkuHo