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General discussionAnnouncement: Big Preorders & Launch Day Releases Coming!(4041 posts)(4041 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted February 21, 2014
The DRM-Free Revolution Continues with Big Pre-Orders and Launch Day Releases!

Good news! GOG.com is going to bring you more fantastic launch day releases, preorders, and other exciting new content from some of our favorite developers. We've lined up 3 big titles that we will be bringing to GOG.com in the next couple of months for sale or preorder that we think will be hits with all of our gamers; and we have more equally exciting games coming up soon.

If you've been a member of the site for a long time, you may recall that when we launched sales of The Witcher 2 on GOG.com, we had to add in regional pricing. The game cost different amounts in in the US, the UK, the European Union, and Australia. We're doing something like that once again in order to bring you new titles from fantastic bigger studios. Since we don't accept currencies other than USD on GOG.com right now, we'll be charging the equivalent of the local price in USD for these titles. We wish that we could offer these games at flat prices everywhere in the world, but the decision on pricing is always in our partners' hands, and regional pricing is becoming the standard around the globe. We're doing this because we believe that there's no better way to accomplish our overall goals for DRM-Free gaming and GOG.com. We need more games, devs, and publishers on board to make DRM-Free gaming something that's standard for all of the gaming world!

That brings with it more good news, though! As mentioned, we have three games we're launching soon with regional pricing--two RPGs and a strategy game--and while we can't tell you what they are yet because breaking an NDA has more severe penalties than just getting a noogie, we're confident that you'll be as excited about these games as we are. For a limited time, we will be offering anyone who pre-orders or buys one of them a free game from a selection as a gift from GOG.com, just like we did for The Witcher 2.

If you have any questions, hit us up in the comments below and we'll be happy to answer (to the best of our ability).

EDIT: Since we've answered a lot of the common questions already here (and lest you think that we've ignored you), it may be handy for you to check out the forum thread about this and search for staff answers by clicking this link here. (hat tip to user Eli who reminded us that the feature even exists. :)
Posted February 25, 2014
As a long time costumer I feel disapointed in GOG.

In your search for growth you have been loosing your identity, the things that really set you appart from the rest:

- Gaming site dedicated to Good Old Games (classics)
- Flat price across the globe
- DRM Free

Since you introduced regular indie games, the site lost some of it's appeal, but I kept coming back almost every day to see what's new.

Now you are doing away with flat price and bringing AAA games into the mix.

What's next? DRM? (yes, I've already read your answers on this one)

I understand you want to grow, but you should consider creating a parallel platform for this and stop screwing around with GOG.

I really respect what you have been doing up until now, and I have supported you as much as I can (my collection is over 130 games), but if you keep threading this path I think I'll stick with Steam...
Posted February 25, 2014
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Lodium: what do you call trading in AH in WoW then or even better Diablo 3 Style AH were blizzard charged users a small fee if they
used real money on virtual items?

Virtual items is Digital goods is it not?
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gkoczyk: I would call it a massive scam, where you exchange money (most probably) for nothing at all (having signed all the agreements to this effect). Not that some people don't cash out (even in pyramid schemes some people do manage to cash out, before the whole thing flops).

IANAL disclaimer - this is my own, subjective understanding, not a legal interpretation/advice of any form.

As long as the money is virtual (can't cash out) - virtual items legally don't exist, no more than stock trading exercices conducted in our heads would exist. This is the best scenario for the corporations like Blizzard. This is why most games have "we own all ur pixels" provisions in the EULAs and things like D2JSP are at best gray area (ie. D2JSP is not Blizzard's legal problem due to "own pixels" clause and government turns a blind eye).

When the money becomes physical or has the potential to do so (ie. you can cash out for real currency), varying laws kick in (e.g. gambling, anti-money laundering, anti-fraud). I suppose this is why some countries had to either have the Auction House stripped out (Korea IIRC) or be locked out of "cashing out" (Brazil, Argentina - http://us.blizzard.com/en-us/company/legal/d3rmah_tou.html ). And I would wager a small amount of money, arising legal issues affected Blizzard's decision not to keep the Diablo AH around (shuts by April, IIRC; they never disclosed how much work their legal department had with day-to-day AH operations and fiscal stuff).

Clearly defined relationships between in-game virtual goods and physical money are in nobody's interest but the consumer. Thus they will not crystallise under current conditions (not in the interest of countries, not in the interest of corporations).

PS. Ironically, both Diablo 3 and WoW are "gambling" (by common sense) - you pull that lever until shiny things pop out (delayed, random rewards; degree of reward not directly dependent on user actions; massive success possible but odds are astronomical).
The problem is not that simple.
In Diablo 3 AH you coud indeed cash out.
The money wasnt only virtual, though if you used this feature Blizard charged a fee to the users that sold and bougth to eachother for real money.
The other AH were only virtual money were in use was free to use as far as i can remember.

And as i said Blizard isnt the only company that have done this or are doing it.
Post edited February 25, 2014 by Lodium
Posted February 25, 2014
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ghostgate2001: Hey, when did the "one world, one fair price" reason vanish from the "reasons why you'll love GOG" banner on the front page? Did I miss the "Now You've Got One Less Reason to Love GOG!" announcement? ;-)
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Reaper9988: I never really checked the banner much but the no regional pricing was on there and now it's gone ?

I'm having an Arenanet/Turbine flashback.

And uh did i miss the letter or something ?
Yes indeed, it always used to be there. 4 reasons. Now there are 3.

It says your location is US, so if you never saw that reason then maybe it only appeared in countries that don't use US dollars? I guess GOG explaining why all their prices were in USD and why that was a good thing would be a bit superfluous for US customers! -)
Posted February 25, 2014
You know what's "funny"? All those interviews lately where GOG reps have been hinting at a major change in the first months of the year, but the only hint was a "we'll make it easier for people to..." "slipped" once. Now put this through the perspective of those messages.
Posted February 25, 2014
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Reaper9988: I never really checked the banner much but the no regional pricing was on there and now it's gone ?

I'm having an Arenanet/Turbine flashback.

And uh did i miss the letter or something ?
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ghostgate2001: Yes indeed, it always used to be there. 4 reasons. Now there are 3.

It says your location is US, so if you never saw that reason then maybe it only appeared in countries that don't use US dollars? I guess GOG explaining why all their prices were in USD and why that was a good thing would be a bit superfluous for US customers! -)
Oh that region setting is still from Witcher 2 i think never bothered to change it heh.
I meant i never bothered to read the whole banner thing because i knew why i shop at GOG so i never knew how many reasons are on there.

Removing it just like that is a tad shady, not what i'd expect of GOG.
Posted February 25, 2014
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HypersomniacLive: Sort of picking up where we left of a couple of days off.
I recall you saying this the other day too. If the typical retail box contains nth but a Steam key how can it be an alternative to folks living in countries/ areas with poor/ unreliable communication infrastructure?
To me it just sounds like publishers having found another way to offer a retail edition that costs them less and brings in more while exploiting people's preference/ focus to Steam.
Retail versions include a disc with much of the game data on which lets you avoid having to download most of it - only having to download things like the binaries and any available patches. You run the installer on the disc, the installer starts Steam if not already running (installing Steam first if necessary), Steam logs in & requests the key if you haven't activated it already and after that it lets you start the install using the data provided on the disc.

That raises an interesting question - how much more is the average person willing to pay for a DRM-free release? Or better yet, how much more are they realistically able to pay? And what are the valid arguments for charging more?
I never use this as one of points, regardless of my willingness (or ability) to pay more. The simple reason being that I don't want to cultivate the notion DRM-free should be treated as an exception or worse as a super-extra luxury for the few. I'm trying to push into the direction that DRM-free should be seen and provided as a standard alternative.
I can't answer for anyone else, but for me DRM is something that significantly detracts from the value of any software and I take this into account accordingly when considering how much I'm willing to pay (or if I decide to avoid it completely, depending on the DRM involved). Conversely, I'm prepared pay more for things that are DRM-free in order to provide an incentive & encourage further DRM-free releases.

It's a big thing to convince big publishers to drop DRM on their major titles as they (and especially their investors) still see it as a big risk. In addition to this, most of them are generally more than happy enough with their sales on Steam with both regional pricing and DRM.

Change is a gradual process and it's unreasonable to expect the industry to make two very major changes at once... especially when one of those changes would - at this time - mean having to throw away a large chunk of their global sales. For now we can change their stance on DRM, and we can see about changing their stance on regional pricing later.
Post edited February 25, 2014 by adamhm
Posted February 25, 2014
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rawmilk905: I do not, nor will I ever have a Steam account. I only signed up on GamersGate at the behest of Licurg, and I own next to nothing there, seven games presently, only two of which were not free or gifted (trades for GOG codes.) I don't use other games stores. There are 338 games on my GOG shelf right now, and 169 gift codes I counted that I've purchased. GOG has been the only place I buy games and the only reason I bought so much here was your ethical standards, which we were lead to believe you were steadfastly devoted to. I never minded if I tried a game I hadn't heard of and didn't like it, because I was supporting efforts I believed in by a company I trusted.
I'm pretty much with you on all of this. I do not have a Steam account, although that meant missing out on quite a few games I was interested in. I have, at the moment of this post, the (for me personally) ridiculous number of 177 games in my GOG library, as well as at least 1-2 dozen gift codes. Opposed to that I have purchased a total of 0 (zero) games on other online distribution platforms.

I had no problems with GOG expanding their catalogue by including contemporary indie games, I liked that a lot actually. Those are games that, to me, often are a great addition to the awesome games of old, and I very much appreciated being able to get them without DRM and at reasonable prices.

I tried to convince as many of my friends as I could to make an account here, sometimes luring them over by gifting them games. Most of them have little to no objections to Steam (and such), and therefore have most of their gaming library there and understandibly want to keep it nicely under one roof.

The dangerous thing imo about further watering down the initial GOG principles is that making it resemble other game stores won't really give it any advantage. Those who already use Steam etc will likely go on using Steam etc, unless GOG has some dramatic fresh ideas about how to make itself unique. The problem being that they already are (were?) unique, and are risking to lose part of that uniqueness as well as some of their loyal customers that were attracted by just that.
Posted February 25, 2014
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Digital_CHE: The ONLY Battlefield title that I like is Bad Company 2, because is DRMFREE since the R11 patch.
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JohnnyDollar: I was unaware of that. Is it worth playing for the single player only? I'm assuming not. I might be interested in picking up a cheap copy if it is, because I don't have any interest in the multiplayer.
Well. I don't Multiplayers... The single player campaing is not WOW, but is not boring.. And You have to explore if You want to destroy some specific computers in every map...

The R11 patch removes the Securom DRM of the PHYSICAL version.. So, I can install it OFFLINE on every computer I have and play it without the DVD on drive. :)

I dont' understand why EA removed the DRM of this game in particular and not other games like Crysis or Crysis: Warhead.
Posted February 25, 2014
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Lodium: The problem is not that simple.
In Diablo 3 AH you coud indeed cash out.
The money wasnt only virtual, though if you used this feature Blizard charged a fee to the users that sold and bougth to eachother for real money.
The other AH were only virtual money in use was free to use as far as i can remember.

And as i said Blizard isnt the only company that have done this or are doing it.
In Blizzard's case - not for much longer. And again, their EULAs do not give you any leg to argue ownership of "your" items. If you read through RMAH Terms of Use you will notice it is always "right to use virtual items" that gets transferred. You could argue that they give you a temporary but transferrable right, however that's it.

Most concepts are established in D3 EULA itself. See Point 4 (emphasis mine):

4. Ownership.
All title, ownership rights and intellectual property rights in and to the Game and all copies thereof (including without limitation any titles, computer code, themes, objects, characters, character names, stories, dialog, catch phrases, locations, concepts, artwork, structural or landscape designs, animations, sounds, musical compositions and recordings, audio-visual effects, storylines, character likenesses, methods of operation, moral rights, and any related documentation) are owned or licensed by Blizzard. The Game is protected by the copyright laws of the United States, international treaties and conventions, and other laws. The Game may contain materials licensed by third parties, and the licensors of those materials may enforce their rights in the event of any violation of this License Agreement. You have no interest, monetary or otherwise, in any feature or content contained in the Game or associated with the Account.
Another example: RMAH ToU, Section 6, Point D (emphasis mine)

D. Each auction that has been completed must be verified by Blizzard. Once verified, Blizzard will transfer the license to use the Loot from the seller to you. If Blizzard does not verify the auction, the auction will be disqualified, and the Loot will be returned to the Seller’s in-game stash.
Posted February 25, 2014
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Reaper9988: I never really checked the banner much but the no regional pricing was on there and now it's gone ?

I'm having an Arenanet/Turbine flashback.

And uh did i miss the letter or something ?
Correction, it's A$$Net not ArenaNet.
Posted February 25, 2014
I was beginning to think I missed the letter or it won't display for me. :/
Posted February 25, 2014
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Cavalary: Other news pieces with comment threads (counting >10 comments only): , [url=http://www.polygon.com/2014/2/23/5439848/gog-returning-to-regional-pricing-for-upcoming-games]Polygon, , [url=http://www.kotaku.com.au/2014/02/australia-included-in-gogs-regional-pricing-for-new-games/]Kotaku Australia, , [url=http://www.ausgamers.com/news/read/3416007/three-big-titles-coming-to-gog-necessitate-regional-price-disparity]Ausgamers, Game Debate

Other forum threads: , [url=http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?p=35358405]Steam, , [url=http://forums.hexus.net/gaming/315897-gog-introduce-regional-pricing.html]Hexus, CD Projekt (includes poll, sadly with a clear majority on yes), , [url=http://www.quartertothree.com/game-talk/showthread.php?74586-Regional-Pricing-(First-Humble-Bundle-and-now-GOG-implement-regional-prices)&p=3529242]Quarter to Three, , [url=http://ces.gamespot.com/forums/pc-mac-discussion-1000004/gog-introduces-regional-pricing-gog-community-resp-31099825/]GameSpot

That's after going through just 5 pages of a Google search, sure to be more...
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Bloodygoodgames: I saw a few of these and, yep, it''s pretty much a PR nightmare for GOG.

Not really sure why they thought it would be any different?

Oh well.......... There are always other places to buy games, DRM-Free or otherwise, and often at cheaper prices so, now I'm over being depressed about the lack of backbone and ethics at GOG.........moving on :)

They've now shoveled themselves into a huge pile of shit and I'm guessing they'll be dealing with it for a while.

And no, no comment from the CEO of the company. Just adds insult to injury and shows, yet again, a complete lack of business sense.
May I ask you a question? Please don't think I'm attacking you, I understand your point of view and respect it but... why are you still here? I don't get it, you've already repeated "I'm done with GOG" several times, you constantly sling mud at GOG and yet you're constantly coming back. What for? Shit (literal and metaphorical) is something I prefer to avoid, you on the other hand keep playing with it. Or at least it seems so. Please don't get me wrong, I do understand your point of view and frankly, I'm partially sharing it (but without using word "shit" or synonyms in every second sentence) but if GOG is so bad why are you still here? You are most probably still downloading your games but why do you visit forum? Does it make you feel better when you are bashing GOG? Sorry, I don't get it...
Posted February 25, 2014
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Nicole28: I was beginning to think I missed the letter or it won't display for me. :/
More like they just skipped it and hoped we'd forget...
Posted February 25, 2014
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Orcomondo: Wonderful, basically i'm going to get overpriced USA games since i will play them in English (usually a shared UK/USA local) due my EU country localization been inexistent or terrible. That's a real deal, i love regional prices.

We are getting regional price because "it's not up to us" for a couple AAA title that however won't really be fully DMR free.

I know it's the only way to bring new AAA title in gog but please try to enforce the no region price rule strictly on non AAA games.
Actually, I don't think these supposed AAA games have anything to do with why all of a sudden GOG no longer believes in region free pricing.

I think they have decided this is the way the company is going and they're using these three games as an excuse, ie: blame the publishers and so take some of the blame of ourselves. After all, when games don't have region free pricing, GOG will make a much higher profit from those gamers who live in Europe, Russia, the UK and Australia.

You can tell this when you read between the lines of anything any of the GOG staffers are saying about this -- all of which, to me, seems to be so much 'doublespeak' covering nothing but greed.
Posted February 25, 2014
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Lodium: The problem is not that simple.
In Diablo 3 AH you coud indeed cash out.
The money wasnt only virtual, though if you used this feature Blizard charged a fee to the users that sold and bougth to eachother for real money.
The other AH were only virtual money in use was free to use as far as i can remember.

And as i said Blizard isnt the only company that have done this or are doing it.
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gkoczyk: In Blizzard's case - not for much longer. And again, their EULAs do not give you any leg to argue ownership of "your" items. If you read through RMAH Terms of Use you will notice it is always "right to use virtual items" that gets transferred. You could argue that they give you a temporary but transferrable right, however that's it.

Most concepts are established in D3 EULA itself. See Point 4 (emphasis mine):

4. Ownership.
All title, ownership rights and intellectual property rights in and to the Game and all copies thereof (including without limitation any titles, computer code, themes, objects, characters, character names, stories, dialog, catch phrases, locations, concepts, artwork, structural or landscape designs, animations, sounds, musical compositions and recordings, audio-visual effects, storylines, character likenesses, methods of operation, moral rights, and any related documentation) are owned or licensed by Blizzard. The Game is protected by the copyright laws of the United States, international treaties and conventions, and other laws. The Game may contain materials licensed by third parties, and the licensors of those materials may enforce their rights in the event of any violation of this License Agreement. You have no interest, monetary or otherwise, in any feature or content contained in the Game or associated with the Account.
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gkoczyk: Another example: RMAH ToU, Section 6, Point D (emphasis mine)

D. Each auction that has been completed must be verified by Blizzard. Once verified, Blizzard will transfer the license to use the Loot from the seller to you. If Blizzard does not verify the auction, the auction will be disqualified, and the Loot will be returned to the Seller’s in-game stash.
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gkoczyk:
Yeah, obviously somebody doesn't acquire an ownership interest in Diablo III's assets or anything like that just by buying the game. That's all that paragraph on ownership is saying. It's just saying you don't own the IP and can't go off and use it for your own nefarious purposes. The second bit you posted does cover in-game items, though I question the legal validity of that clause. It's rare that US courts will find something unconscionable and we're not particularly pro-consumer over here, but so many of these digital goods rights are really skirting the line.
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionAnnouncement: Big Preorders & Launch Day Releases Coming!(4041 posts)(4041 posts)
(4041 posts)