I'm currently (idk, 25%, 3rd island) through G3 but feeling like taking a bit of a rest from the series. What I will say is that the reviews generally are unfaithful and a bit manufactured.

The game uses a simple "proshaper / anti-shaper" scale which really sucks: Greta accusing me of mistreating outsiders when I have been helping them whenever I could, (protecting the secrets of my order, of course... and eliminating rogue creations, but helping others due to my duty to provide when my sect denies them the ability to defend themselves.)

What I mean to indicate is that the choices are rather... lacking. They're easy to roleplay into; but the effects are predictably "anti-shaper vs pro-shaper" rather than some combination of various lines.




The first game was a bit insane as well; I started out with the Obeyers... then I managed to join the Takers somehow (now WHY they didn't kill me on sight, idk. I was seeking to imprison them all and they welcome me in as if I was a friend.) Then I went back and joined the Awakened (because... why not). And then I joined the Obeyers again.... and then I joined / exterminated the Takers (who were worshiping me by not killing me for double crossing everyone).

And despite my genocide of the serviles (and the Sholai) Trajkov says all is forgiven... never really liked those pesky serviles anyways. (Well yes, they do change his personality; but Trajkov is portrayed as being a natural being for modification.)



I was having a bit of fun with Geneforge Two; acting as a double agent within the Takers... and learning what horrifying things they were up to... (and wondering if the dark insinuations were true)... before convincing the best of them to go kill himself while I watched. Having already destroyed everyone except the awakened, I began wondering what they were up to... and joined them to find out. The Horrors! I left without renouncing my alliance and then I got... an "incomplete ending".

The over-effectiveness of just a little leadership / mechanics also should be in effect (you have to willingly choose to keep these cheap skills down and suffer the consequences).



Really, the game is the story, exactly how a cRPG should be. Too often we focus on graphics, sounds, "gameplay" when we're really wanting a good yarn. I whole heartedly accuse Geneforge 2 of being a ripoff of Geneforge 1... and it is! But then he added intrigue, he fleshed the factions out much more than they ever were. The story may follow the same "story" in many regards; but it is being retold in a way that "super graphics bro" games don't take advantage of.


And yet, why I'm bored is because Geneforge is very unforgiving if the wrong choices are made... such as rainbowing a "roleplayed" Guardian before making the melee stats strong. (Was considering having only level 1 creations until untenable then going to the cryoa, searing atilla, and shade thayd... but then put way too many points around meaning I cannot shape the next level up, I cannot tank, I cannot hit (Being dependent on bless is bad), I cannot kill (because of the rainbowing), and I cannot cast. Perfect XD. Will have to restart at some point.


I forgot what I was posting anyways ;p

I've played through the first three games, but I certainly didn't play them all in a row. Despite new settings and storylines, they're pretty similar gaming experiences. Interact with different factions, choose who to support and who to oppose, all while building up a character. I liked being able to try out different builds and choices within a new story and setting each time, but in many ways it felt like replaying the same game rather than playing three different games.

I hear that games 4 and 5 in the series have more significant changes, however. I'll get around to them eventually.

Well, to be a bit more sane...
My complaint lies more with not having enough text XD.

I mean, reactivating both control minds (in Geneforge 1) doesn't result in weaker factions. Even exterminating the takers in Geneforge 2 still results in the Awakened being annihilated (despite their defenses). It is rather disappointing how linear things really are under the mask.

Geneforge 3 presented itself as being very ready to have multiple variables:

Protect Shaper Secrets -> Share Shaper Secrets
Use Leadership (shaper "superiority") to take advantage of outsiders -> Help outsiders with their petty problems
Destroy all rogues -> Empathize with rogues

(but it only uses Proshaper->antishaper)

And I generally dislike the linear quest chain that doesn't allow branching. The Rebels (Geneforge 3) don't want the monsters gone, they want shaper powers... I tried to explain that I would destroy every monster on the island, even (literally) did so... but they still yelled about wanting shaper powers.

But w/e... playing the games in a row is probably bad for you ;p

I'm at a point in GF1 (my first SpiderWeb game ever) that I too am getting...I hate to say "bored" because the story is so intriguing, but yeah, a little bored.

I was rolling right along very nicely as a Shaper, doing well with my creations. Met The Awakened & listened to their ways, then met The Obeyers & decided I wanted to ally with them. Having heard plenty about The Takers, I robbed them one time too many in Kazg & decided that since I'd already aligned with The Obeyers, why not just kill all Takers? They seemed to be my biggest threat, so I was at a high enough level that I did it with relative ease...just purged everyone in Kazg.

Ended up missing a few quests, as it seems there are map areas that have no idea I wiped out Kazg. I've got serviles telling me to go to Kazg and find peop...I mean, CREATIONS...that I've already killed. Regardless, I decided to wander around and do some area purging, looking for more canisters & whatever else pops up.

I also think I've wiped out all of The Awakened. Pissed them off one too many times as well, and figured let nature take its course...I defended myself until they were all gone.

I found what I *think* is the location of the boat to get me off this island, but I'm just insanely underpowered to handle the battle(s) needed to get through the area. So instead, I've cleared a bunch of other areas across the island.

I think the reason I'm feeling some boredom now is that I don't know what to do next to progress the story. It looks like I've cleared the bottom half of the island, I'm Level 19, I have more money than I know what to do with, and I haven't found anything "questy" to do in a while. Lots of exploring on my own and even discovering more about the history of the island, but I feel like I'm lacking in direction right now & just kinda grinding the wilderness for XP.

The endgame stuff is in the northeastern part of the map, if I remember correctly. I don't remember whether I had a specific quest to go there or if I just explored in that direction on my own, but you should be able to get back into some story-related business if you head that way.

I never tried killing off entire settlements so I don't know how that affects the quests in the game.

I just(As in a few minutes ago) beat game 5 for the second time, and have beaten all the games in the set twice(3 I've beaten 3 times, once for shaper, then for rebel, and then with Alwin and Shaper, didn't get him or Greta the first time as they were rather....limited compared to my preferred squad of Vlish, might replay one last time to get Greta and Rebel end)

As stated by some above, I find the games rather disappointing in what does and does not affect the story. As a prime example, in game 3, the second island has a rebellion going on completely separate from the main one. This rebellion is because the people don't think the local shaper lord is doing enough to help them against the rogues, and the rebellion's leader has been contacted by Latallia and offered resources. When you point out that the rogues are something little Miss Double Talk made to the leader of the local rebellion, he basically says it doesn't matter, and there is no option to tell anyone else in the rebellion or anywhere on the island what happened and why.

Still, putting aside some limits, which I will allow given the small team that made this, I find the story, the characters, and the setting very much interesting. The gameplay suffers a bit, but is still better than many of it's contemporaries, including the other Spiderweb games(Bought the other saga, that A word I can't remember, and am finding them lacking in almost all respects compared to geneforge)

Oh, and 4 and 5 are quite different, in both tone, graphics, and everything else. Mostly because instead of you being special because you're the only one there to help, in those games the reason you're special is more nebulous, and in 4 it gets patently ridiculous in the Fen's area where both sides basically say you can't leave until the local threat is dealt with(Though at least the shapers claim this is only a resource saving measure, if you die they're out one spy, as opposed to the forces it would take otherwise.

That's the Avernum series. Most of those games are older than the Geneforge games... I think Avernum 1-3 came first (and were remakes of even older games called Exile), then Geneforge 1-3, then development of Avernum 4-6 and Geneforge 4-5 were kind of interspersed. In both series, things get pretty different after the first three games.

I quite like the Avernum games, although I played them before Geneforge, but they're much more traditional in design. Build a party of adventurers, do quests, etc. Not a big focus on moral choices like in Geneforge. But the Avernum games still have great writing.

You might be interested to check out Avadon: The Black Fortress. It's Spiderweb's most recent game, in a new setting, and it looks like it combines the moral choices of the Geneforge series with a party-based role-playing game. I haven't played it yet, but it got good reviews.

Well, I had hoped to finish the entire game without having to use a walkthrough, but to my credit, I used it sparingly. I really made things harder for myself by destroying 2 of the 3 sects...just took away far too many quests, leaving me with little direction later in the game (as I voiced previously in this thread), but the game was still finishable. Quite enjoyed the storytelling, and I didn't even go the "completionist" route I normally do by going into every area available...quite sandbox that way, in that the story still made sense regardless (although I do wonder what other secrets I may have missed out on).

Now to move on to either GF2, Avernum 1, or Avadon 1...tough call.

It's pretty hard to do that in the Geneforge games anyway, as different areas are designed for different character builds. There are usually paths with more traps and less combat for people who built sneakier characters, but if you are using a creation-heavy combat build those areas are more or less impossible to navigate. As I said earlier in the thread, the Geneforge games all feel pretty similar. I'm not sure I'd recommend moving straight to the next one without taking a break. But that may just be how I play, so you should do whatever you want.

Geneforge 2 is equivalent of Fallout 2 to Fallout 1: better, bigger, more balances while retain the same UI and gameplay balance. It's the 3, 4 and 5 that tends more linear especially third one with content around fewer choices but multiple revisions of them if one works for certain faction, then different part will unlock upon you more but be incomplete for the other.

Geneforge 1 on the other hand has unique atmosphere of seclusion and mystery, you are alone, other humans are foreigns who aren't much help and all other folks you find are rogue creations. You are alone, everything stalks for your life and there's no reward for cowards (you get very poor ending for speedrunning game just to the boat). Raising low end creations (Fyora) to high level monsters (end game max level/stats Fyora is close to skill 3 Drayk) is fun but you will quickly find running out of Essence to raise stats of your pet where for ex. more reasonable is Drayk with better stats for less Essence only put to summoning and 2 in Intelligence for manual control.

After very little debate, I decided to go to GF2...I'm enjoying this fresh new world enough that I'm not ready to switch to a traditional fantasy setting with Avernum just yet.

But I'm doing GF2 with a different character. Still using a Shaper (I like having creations), but with an entirely different set of morals and values. My first GF1 character was all about amassing personal wealth and power & having creations for offensive purposes, but this one is about taking his time and making more informed decisions while using his creations to defend himself. I guess you could say my GF1 guy was Lawful Evil (completely self-centered according to his very specific belief system), while this one is more Neutral Good (he'll try to do what we would generally consider the right thing to do, but may sometimes bend the rules a bit if he feels its for the greater good).

Looking forward to this. :-)

When I get bored, I do a little thing called 'rampage mode'.

I wouldn't describe Avernum's subterranean setting as traditional. The world is actually really interesting. It's more the game design that's traditional, with its party of four heroes who generally do good deeds.

Good to know!