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EVERSPACE 2REFUND becouse No relative mouse Control(22 posts)(22 posts)
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Posted May 11, 2021
I expected the mouse control like Descent or Elite Dangerous. I was very disappointed with strange mouse behavior. I do not want infinite spinning. Why there is not implemented normal control like has nearly every shooter games (even "Everspace I" i think)? This game is unplayeable for me. I am sorry about it, becouse the game itself looks good. If will be in the game implemented normal mouse control I will buy imediatelly.
Post edited May 11, 2021 by refuse666
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Posted May 11, 2021
avatar
refuse666: I expected the mouse control like Descent or Elite Dangerous. I was very disappointed with strange mouse behavior. I do not want infinite spinning. Why there is not implemented normal control like has nearly every shooter games (even "Everspace I" i think)? This game is unplayeable for me. I am sorry about it, becouse the game itself looks good. If will be in the game implemented normal mouse control I will buy imediatelly.
Hi Refuse666,

Sorry to hear that, but luckily GOG has a very generous refund policity.
Since you've probably made up your mind, theres not much left I could say.
I just want to point out that the controls in ES2 are identical to ES1.
And there are some quality of life features, that you probalbly already tested (as for example fixing the crosshair to to the center of the screen, sensitivity and deadzone setting etc.) to help people with the controls.

But if this didn't help, there isn't much we can do for you right now.
I don't know when (or if) we will implement rubber band controls.
If we do at some point, I hope you'll give the game another shot.

Best regards
Ingmar
Posted May 11, 2021
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refuse666: I expected the mouse control like Descent or Elite Dangerous. I was very disappointed with strange mouse behavior. I do not want infinite spinning. Why there is not implemented normal control like has nearly every shooter games (even "Everspace I" i think)? This game is unplayeable for me. I am sorry about it, becouse the game itself looks good. If will be in the game implemented normal mouse control I will buy imediatelly.
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RFG_Ingmar: Hi Refuse666,

Sorry to hear that, but luckily GOG has a very generous refund policity.
Since you've probably made up your mind, theres not much left I could say.
I just want to point out that the controls in ES2 are identical to ES1.
And there are some quality of life features, that you probalbly already tested (as for example fixing the crosshair to to the center of the screen, sensitivity and deadzone setting etc.) to help people with the controls.

But if this didn't help, there isn't much we can do for you right now.
I don't know when (or if) we will implement rubber band controls.
If we do at some point, I hope you'll give the game another shot.

Best regards
Ingmar
Thak you for reply. In Everspace one (I tested it in my friend) when I set mouse centered position everything works fine. So it is not true about the same control mechanism in Everspace 2.
Maybe it is only a bug. Please let me know about fixing this problem. I will be buy game again, as I promissed. Thanx.
Post edited May 11, 2021 by refuse666
Posted May 11, 2021
Hey Refuse666,

I need to appologize! You are completely right that ES1 has input zeroed out over time in centered mode, while ES2 hasn't. And I thought I had played ES1 enough to know it inside out. Turns out I was wrong. I'll check why this feature wasn't carried over and come back to with an answer.
Posted May 11, 2021
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RFG_Ingmar: Hey Refuse666,

I need to appologize! You are completely right that ES1 has input zeroed out over time in centered mode, while ES2 hasn't. And I thought I had played ES1 enough to know it inside out. Turns out I was wrong. I'll check why this feature wasn't carried over and come back to with an answer.
Thank you very much. I hope that this function will be implemented. I am not alone with this problem. I checked some forums. For example Steam.
I will looking forward to answer.
Post edited May 11, 2021 by refuse666
Posted May 12, 2021
Ok the answer lies in the broader variaty of ships agility in ES2 over ES1.

Andi actually tested the old system and ended up with controls, where you can't find a common setting that feels good for lets say Scouts and Gunships.

You either need to (physically) lift your mouse a annoying amount of times to turn a heavy ship, or end up with 'A Scout on a stick' that seems to be glued to your head.
The current solution would be to make ships more similar to each other, which is a thing we really want to avoid.

We may revisit this issue later. But we can't make any promises on this yet. So if the controls are a deal breaker for you, you should go ahead with your refund.

I link the original thread here

Best regards,
Ingmar
Posted May 12, 2021
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RFG_Ingmar: Ok the answer lies in the broader variaty of ships agility in ES2 over ES1.

Andi actually tested the old system and ended up with controls, where you can't find a common setting that feels good for lets say Scouts and Gunships.

You either need to (physically) lift your mouse a annoying amount of times to turn a heavy ship, or end up with 'A Scout on a stick' that seems to be glued to your head.
The current solution would be to make ships more similar to each other, which is a thing we really want to avoid.

We may revisit this issue later. But we can't make any promises on this yet. So if the controls are a deal breaker for you, you should go ahead with your refund.

I link the original thread here

Best regards,
Ingmar
Hi Ingmar,
Thank you for your time. So this is not a bug but new feature?
It is not very positive answer.

The same problem was in X4 foundations. They implemented the function later becouse users complaied (X3 series worked good).
So they decided put the old function back.

There is a solution. In the game there is a posibility assign the key to change mouse behavior on the fly. It is elegant way. Why not let the users to choose how control the game? Users can control small ships normally with cenetered mouse and big ships by the fly mouse method. In the fact I do this in X4 (or simply I can use the arrow at keyboard for rotate big ships). Of course I can set inverted or no-inverted mouse (Y-Axis) for both ways.
I think this solution would be good for Everspace 2 too.
Post edited May 12, 2021 by refuse666
Posted May 14, 2021
It would be good if Rockfish would add more control modes (without replacing ones already implemented), yes. However, it is not true there is something wrong with the game only because it does not provide every possible control mode. It merely means the game is less user-friendly than maximum theoretical amount of user-friendliness - as long as it's possible to learn game's current controls well enough to enjoy desired kind of gameplay.

And it is, because i and many others did so. Also, it's not that hard, too.

P.S. In War Thunder, there are several control modes with lots of detailed settings. Most people do not use even quarter of what's there. Some do, including myself. A dedicated button to switch between control modes "on the fly" exists there, too - and i am one of quite few pilots who actually use it, and who's comfortable with more than one specific control mode at any given moment (in my case, in WT, that's "mouse Aim" <> "realistic controls" <> "simulator controls" modes when flying a plane). This is why this issue, while significant, - is likely much secondary in compare to all sorts of tasks the team has at this time (like content creation, game systems' creation, ship designs, etc). If this all is correct, then logical conclusion would be that extra control modes and any major additions to control schemes - are likely to happen some time near full release (either few months prior to it, or few months after it). I think.
Post edited May 14, 2021 by Fins_FinsT
Posted May 14, 2021
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Fins_FinsT: It would be good if Rockfish would add more control modes (without replacing ones already implemented), yes. However, it is not true there is something wrong with the game only because it does not provide every possible control mode. It merely means the game is less user-friendly than maximum theoretical amount of user-friendliness - as long as it's possible to learn game's current controls well enough to enjoy desired kind of gameplay.

And it is, because i and many others did so. Also, it's not that hard, too.

P.S. In War Thunder, there are several control modes with lots of detailed settings. Most people do not use even quarter of what's there. Some do, including myself. A dedicated button to switch between control modes "on the fly" exists there, too - and i am one of quite few pilots who actually use it, and who's comfortable with more than one specific control mode at any given moment (in my case, in WT, that's "mouse Aim" <> "realistic controls" <> "simulator controls" modes when flying a plane). This is why this issue, while significant, - is likely much secondary in compare to all sorts of tasks the team has at this time (like content creation, game systems' creation, ship designs, etc). If this all is correct, then logical conclusion would be that extra control modes and any major additions to control schemes - are likely to happen some time near full release (either few months prior to it, or few months after it). I think.
I created an autohotkey little script that slowly returns the mouse to center ( spring effect). It works perfectly with system mouse mode, but sometimes, specially when dog-fighting with dampeners off, the spring effect puts too much strain on my aim, and I have to deactivate it. Since I played Everspace 1 with the mouse, I got used to this, and it allows fine targeting on the middle of a fray.
The mouse could really have a spring effect with minimal code added, and have a toggle button like capslock. Yet, It won't be as good as a true joystick.
Posted May 14, 2021
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Fins_FinsT: It would be good if Rockfish would add more control modes (without replacing ones already implemented), yes. However, it is not true there is something wrong with the game only because it does not provide every possible control mode. It merely means the game is less user-friendly than maximum theoretical amount of user-friendliness - as long as it's possible to learn game's current controls well enough to enjoy desired kind of gameplay.

And it is, because i and many others did so. Also, it's not that hard, too.

P.S. In War Thunder, there are several control modes with lots of detailed settings. Most people do not use even quarter of what's there. Some do, including myself. A dedicated button to switch between control modes "on the fly" exists there, too - and i am one of quite few pilots who actually use it, and who's comfortable with more than one specific control mode at any given moment (in my case, in WT, that's "mouse Aim" <> "realistic controls" <> "simulator controls" modes when flying a plane). This is why this issue, while significant, - is likely much secondary in compare to all sorts of tasks the team has at this time (like content creation, game systems' creation, ship designs, etc). If this all is correct, then logical conclusion would be that extra control modes and any major additions to control schemes - are likely to happen some time near full release (either few months prior to it, or few months after it). I think.
No. Absence basic mouse controls in action games Is epic fail, for me. The same case is if the some action games not posibility set the invert mouse.
The argument that you can learn it or questions why do you want it is unacceptable and irrelevant.

For example, I have never finished Freelancer due to poor control. Once before I gave a chance and finished the game Darkstar One and the only feeling, and the memory of those years I have "disgusting control"
I don't need this.

It is not easy re-learn old habits learns by years.
And why? Due to the small number of games ??? No. There is many others offer it.
I am sorry but I do not play action games without this functions on PC.

I am convinced that somewhere in the trailer I read that Everspace 2 will have the same or even better user interface. So I preordered it. I felt a little cheated when I tried unsuccessfully for a long time to set something that changed.
So I refunded it.
We'll see if the controls change over time.
I like this game and I will definitely give it a 2nd chance.
Until then, I'll play something else.
Post edited May 14, 2021 by refuse666
Posted May 14, 2021
Make no mistake about my previous post: it was just FYI, not any attempt to convince you change your mind about the refund.

Another FYI: it is not a small number of games which use the same mouse control principle ES2 does. Freelancer-style. Lots of folks grew to love it, too. There are good reasons to prefer the one you like best - but also other good reasons to prefer freelancer's way about it. Some of which, Ingmar mentioned above.

Ain't noone "right" or "wrong" here, in other words.

Good luck, and let's hope ES2 will have your favorite mouse controls added before its full release.
Posted May 14, 2021
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Fins_FinsT: Make no mistake about my previous post: it was just FYI, not any attempt to convince you change your mind about the refund.

Another FYI: it is not a small number of games which use the same mouse control principle ES2 does. Freelancer-style. Lots of folks grew to love it, too. There are good reasons to prefer the one you like best - but also other good reasons to prefer freelancer's way about it. Some of which, Ingmar mentioned above.

Ain't noone "right" or "wrong" here, in other words.

Good luck, and let's hope ES2 will have your favorite mouse controls added before its full release.
I hope too.
Posted May 14, 2021
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Fins_FinsT: Make no mistake about my previous post: it was just FYI, not any attempt to convince you change your mind about the refund.

Another FYI: it is not a small number of games which use the same mouse control principle ES2 does. Freelancer-style. Lots of folks grew to love it, too. There are good reasons to prefer the one you like best - but also other good reasons to prefer freelancer's way about it. Some of which, Ingmar mentioned above.

Ain't noone "right" or "wrong" here, in other words.

Good luck, and let's hope ES2 will have your favorite mouse controls added before its full release.
about the controll:

I can't remember any significant game. Except for the Freelancer with only this control (fly mouse method). You can write me one other please.
In contrast, with basic controls, there are many. Thousands.
Post edited May 14, 2021 by refuse666
Posted May 15, 2021
One of War Thunder mouse control modes - is "relative control", same to Freelancer. No Man's Sky, depending on settings, has it as an option as well. One old (but much loved by me) flysim, "Echelon: Wind Warriors" also has it, iirc (6DoF flight, except its interceptor class). Star Citizen confirmed "freelancer type" mouse controls as an option all the way back in 2015, by popular demand, and soon implemented it. Those are no small titles you know, except that old 6DoF one.

That's of the top of my head. Other older ones i can't even remember names of also had it, and no doubt some newer ones i never played - also do.
Posted May 15, 2021
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Fins_FinsT: One of War Thunder mouse control modes - is "relative control", same to Freelancer. No Man's Sky, depending on settings, has it as an option as well. One old (but much loved by me) flysim, "Echelon: Wind Warriors" also has it, iirc (6DoF flight, except its interceptor class). Star Citizen confirmed "freelancer type" mouse controls as an option all the way back in 2015, by popular demand, and soon implemented it. Those are no small titles you know, except that old 6DoF one.

That's of the top of my head. Other older ones i can't even remember names of also had it, and no doubt some newer ones i never played - also do.
Thanks, but this games you mentioned support no only freelancer mouse controll mode, users can choose both types I think. Only Freelancer or X-rebirth (poor game) do not support classic mouse controll. Freelancer has not even joystick support (???). I do not mind if game has fly-mouse mode but I would like to possibility to set normal mouse control also. Thats all. Absence so small thing can ruins whole game for some people.
I do not know, why somebody ingnore the most spread mouse control mode which is use over the decades in PCs games.
Post edited May 15, 2021 by refuse666
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EVERSPACE 2REFUND becouse No relative mouse Control(22 posts)(22 posts)
(22 posts)