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Empire Earth seriesBoredom, then utter Panic. Lousy game.(20 posts)(20 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted November 26, 2009
I'm playing EE:AoC. If you have not purchased this game, I strongly
sugget that you avoid it like the plague.
Ok, I'm getting REALLY frustrated with this game. I've been on a
Civilization 3 forum, where it was revealed to me that the Artificial Intelligence
does, as I suspected, CHEAT! The computer opponents are all aware
of what units you have, without having even come to your settlement.
The various computer civilizations will give each other trade deals that they will
refuse to give you. and etcetera. Lame-O! Needless to say, I don't play
that game any more.
About Empire Earth: I've got the game set only one step up from the easiset setting. I played
the easiest, and it was incredibly boring, especially in later Epochs.
However, now it's also no fun, because it's insanely frustrating. I'm doing
all the right things, building both my economy and my army, and things
are pretty dull. Nothing is happening. Suddenly, ALL of the computer
civilizations attack, all at the same time!!! Their armies are insanely huge.
We started out even, yet obviously they're CHEATING to be able to
build such huge armies so early. And WHY are they ALL arriving at the same time?
What moron designer said, "hey, that would be fun to play, something completely
impossible to win!"
I'm also noticing that the "Space Age" is missing from the Epoch progression. Why?
I recently purchased "Original War" and loved it! This game has a COMMON
SENSE, user-friendly feature.....a slider to adjust game speed!!!! I am not
a computer! I cannot give commands to all of my units simultaneously, or be
in seven different places at once. "Original War" allows you to pause the game,
scroll around, and issue orders.....which will then be carried out when you
un-pause the game! YeAh!! When you are attacked, you can slow the game
down to "slow motion"....as your units take damage, it's easy to retreat and
repair them.
WHY WHY WHY WHY do games like "Civlilization" and "Empire Earth"
lack this common-sense feature??? I'm not a crack-addicted hyper monkey.
If I wanted to mash buttons frantically, I'd go play an arcade game.
The "Real Time" aspect of Real Time Strategy Games BITES INTENSELY>
Posted November 27, 2009
avatar
bearcat33: I'm playing EE:AoC. If you have not purchased this game, I strongly
sugget that you avoid it like the plague.
Ok, I'm getting REALLY frustrated with this game. I've been on a
Civilization 3 forum, where it was revealed to me that the Artificial Intelligence
does, as I suspected, CHEAT! The computer opponents are all aware
of what units you have, without having even come to your settlement.

I strongly disagree with you. I don't think it cheats, it's just playing a lot more aggressively than you are. It's not a stupid AI like some games that pick the cheapest unit and make a mass of them, it comes at you with everything, and if you haven't made defenses against air, ground, and water, you're toast.
Build towers. Build lots of farms (3-4 fully populated mills). Build more citizens. No, way more than that (like, if you haven't produced 500, you're not doing it right). Infantry, tanks, siege weapons, air, water AND anti-air. Don't leave a hole in your defense! The AI will find it.
Don't forget the most rewarding games when you win are the most frustrating to start out with. When you beat it, you're KING OF THE WORLD.
I guess you can tell I love this game.
Posted November 28, 2009
avatar
bearcat33: I'm playing EE:AoC. If you have not purchased this game, I strongly
sugget that you avoid it like the plague.
Ok, I'm getting REALLY frustrated with this game. I've been on a
Civilization 3 forum, where it was revealed to me that the Artificial Intelligence
does, as I suspected, CHEAT! The computer opponents are all aware
of what units you have, without having even come to your settlement.
The various computer civilizations will give each other trade deals that they will
refuse to give you. and etcetera. Lame-O! Needless to say, I don't play
that game any more.
About Empire Earth: I've got the game set only one step up from the easiset setting. I played
the easiest, and it was incredibly boring, especially in later Epochs.
However, now it's also no fun, because it's insanely frustrating. I'm doing
all the right things, building both my economy and my army, and things
are pretty dull. Nothing is happening. Suddenly, ALL of the computer
civilizations attack, all at the same time!!! Their armies are insanely huge.
We started out even, yet obviously they're CHEATING to be able to
build such huge armies so early. And WHY are they ALL arriving at the same time?
What moron designer said, "hey, that would be fun to play, something completely
impossible to win!"
I'm also noticing that the "Space Age" is missing from the Epoch progression. Why?
I recently purchased "Original War" and loved it! This game has a COMMON
SENSE, user-friendly feature.....a slider to adjust game speed!!!! I am not
a computer! I cannot give commands to all of my units simultaneously, or be
in seven different places at once. "Original War" allows you to pause the game,
scroll around, and issue orders.....which will then be carried out when you
un-pause the game! YeAh!! When you are attacked, you can slow the game
down to "slow motion"....as your units take damage, it's easy to retreat and
repair them.
WHY WHY WHY WHY do games like "Civlilization" and "Empire Earth"
lack this common-sense feature??? I'm not a crack-addicted hyper monkey.
If I wanted to mash buttons frantically, I'd go play an arcade game.
The "Real Time" aspect of Real Time Strategy Games BITES INTENSELY>

I completely disagree with you. This is my favorite RTS ever.
However, there are some things you need to be aware of.
First, you can (and should) adjust the game speed up or down or pause it completely in single player. I think the commands are +/- for speed and F3 to pause (but check the manual or key bindings to make sure).
Second, the AI is efficient and aggressive. At the beginning, it is imperative that you either built sufficient defenses (walls, towers, etc.) and/or military units to counter the initial rush. If you don't, it's game over. I prefer to throw up some strategic walls to protect my citizens/resources and then grow my economy, but either approach works.
I find the balancing at the beginning the toughest part. You have to be fast and efficient. Like the above poster said, you need counters for everything. However there are multiple ways to counter.
Don't discount the benefits of economic bonuses or converting enemy units to yours with priests.
Set your speed to very slow and pause often until you get familiar with everything.
Good luck.
Posted December 01, 2009
avatar
bearcat33: I'm playing EE:AoC. If you have not purchased this game, I strongly
sugget that you avoid it like the plague.
Ok, I'm getting REALLY frustrated with this game. I've been on a
Civilization 3 forum, where it was revealed to me that the Artificial Intelligence
does, as I suspected, CHEAT! The computer opponents are all aware
of what units you have, without having even come to your settlement.
The various computer civilizations will give each other trade deals that they will
refuse to give you. and etcetera. Lame-O! Needless to say, I don't play
that game any more.
About Empire Earth: I've got the game set only one step up from the easiset setting. I played
the easiest, and it was incredibly boring, especially in later Epochs.
However, now it's also no fun, because it's insanely frustrating. I'm doing
all the right things, building both my economy and my army, and things
are pretty dull. Nothing is happening. Suddenly, ALL of the computer
civilizations attack, all at the same time!!! Their armies are insanely huge.
We started out even, yet obviously they're CHEATING to be able to
build such huge armies so early. And WHY are they ALL arriving at the same time?
What moron designer said, "hey, that would be fun to play, something completely
impossible to win!"
I'm also noticing that the "Space Age" is missing from the Epoch progression. Why?
I recently purchased "Original War" and loved it! This game has a COMMON
SENSE, user-friendly feature.....a slider to adjust game speed!!!! I am not
a computer! I cannot give commands to all of my units simultaneously, or be
in seven different places at once. "Original War" allows you to pause the game,
scroll around, and issue orders.....which will then be carried out when you
un-pause the game! YeAh!! When you are attacked, you can slow the game
down to "slow motion"....as your units take damage, it's easy to retreat and
repair them.
WHY WHY WHY WHY do games like "Civlilization" and "Empire Earth"
lack this common-sense feature??? I'm not a crack-addicted hyper monkey.
If I wanted to mash buttons frantically, I'd go play an arcade game.
The "Real Time" aspect of Real Time Strategy Games BITES INTENSELY>
avatar
WyleCoyote: I completely disagree with you. This is my favorite RTS ever.
However, there are some things you need to be aware of.
First, you can (and should) adjust the game speed up or down or pause it completely in single player. I think the commands are +/- for speed and F3 to pause (but check the manual or key bindings to make sure).
Second, the AI is efficient and aggressive. At the beginning, it is imperative that you either built sufficient defenses (walls, towers, etc.) and/or military units to counter the initial rush. If you don't, it's game over. I prefer to throw up some strategic walls to protect my citizens/resources and then grow my economy, but either approach works.
I find the balancing at the beginning the toughest part. You have to be fast and efficient. Like the above poster said, you need counters for everything. However there are multiple ways to counter.
Don't discount the benefits of economic bonuses or converting enemy units to yours with priests.
Set your speed to very slow and pause often until you get familiar with everything.
Good luck.

Thank you. I will check on the speed adjustment. It will be crucial during the attacks.
I still can't figure out why or how ALL of the other civilizations show up at the same time, attack me........but while there, don't attack each other!
avatar
bearcat33: I'm playing EE:AoC. If you have not purchased this game, I strongly
sugget that you avoid it like the plague.
Ok, I'm getting REALLY frustrated with this game. I've been on a
Civilization 3 forum, where it was revealed to me that the Artificial Intelligence
does, as I suspected, CHEAT! The computer opponents are all aware
of what units you have, without having even come to your settlement.
avatar
BoxOfSnoo: I strongly disagree with you. I don't think it cheats, it's just playing a lot more aggressively than you are. It's not a stupid AI like some games that pick the cheapest unit and make a mass of them, it comes at you with everything, and if you haven't made defenses against air, ground, and water, you're toast.
Build towers. Build lots of farms (3-4 fully populated mills). Build more citizens. No, way more than that (like, if you haven't produced 500, you're not doing it right). Infantry, tanks, siege weapons, air, water AND anti-air. Don't leave a hole in your defense! The AI will find it.
Don't forget the most rewarding games when you win are the most frustrating to start out with. When you beat it, you're KING OF THE WORLD.
I guess you can tell I love this game.

Uhhhh. Okay. If you define "agressively" as sending the army to invade someone, then
you're correct. I keep it home to defend. When the enemy shows up, I'm pretty certain the quantity of soldiers is literally impossible......they are more than my army, plus my
workers, combined. So, the game is clearly cheating somehow.
Post edited December 01, 2009 by bearcat33
Posted December 01, 2009
avatar
bearcat33: I still can't figure out why or how ALL of the other civilizations show up at the same time, attack me........but while there, don't attack each other!

They've chosen a target to attack - your units. Why would they change their mind just because another army shows up? Does any other strategy game ever do this?
avatar
BoxOfSnoo: I strongly disagree with you. I don't think it cheats, it's just playing a lot more aggressively than you are. It's not a stupid AI like some games that pick the cheapest unit and make a mass of them, it comes at you with everything, and if you haven't made defenses against air, ground, and water, you're toast.
avatar
bearcat33: Uhhhh. Okay. If you define "agressively" as sending the army to invade someone, then
you're correct. I keep it home to defend. When the enemy shows up, I'm pretty certain the quantity of soldiers is literally impossible......they are more than my army, plus my
workers, combined. So, the game is clearly cheating somehow.

It's not literally impossible because if you do it right, you can easily fend off their attacks and even beat them. Therefore, not "clearly cheating".
Look, it takes a lot of practice and skill to learn how to amass the resources and build at the right time and in the right quantity. Nobody's born with this ability! So you lost a couple of games, so what? Learn the way the game works and hammer the AI back, hard! Start with only 1 AI opponent, build WAY more citizens, and send out smaller armies, earlier! Destroy their resources, if you can... ideally before they get towers up.
In other words, don't play it as if it was AoE2.
It's not the fault of the game that you weren't expecting a very challenging AI... I think that's one of its best features!
Posted January 09, 2010
I'm late to this party, but here's a quick comment. AI players will gang up on you if you don't specify teams. I usually put myself on a team with one AI ally and then put two AI opponents on a second team. It makes for a nicely balanced game, and the ally AI in EE seems to be much better than ally AIs in other games.
Overall, EE is an acquired taste. It isn't quite like AOE or AOE 2, but it's a polished RTS with a solid AI.
Posted January 25, 2010
I know I am replying late also, but here is my two cents
First most older games has this what you call a "cheating" AI
Civilazation and EE are harder RTS's, and will take the time and effort to get into them and decently good at them
And for EE it doesnt "know" where your bases are, but oddly sends a ton of scouts then calls it a day when the AI's scouts do find your base. The only way EE "cheats" is the avg common flaw of using a AI. Also the sense of the nature of EE, the computer will make you work hard even on the easiest setting..... and for god sakes never do a huge FFA, because once in a while all computer players will attack you at once.
try a team v team match, or just one vs one to get the hang of things. Also looking at the chart of what counters what helps a TON.
Posted March 16, 2010
Actually the EE AI does cheat - infact if you get down to it most AI in most games cheat in many different ways. Its not a human an it can't get close to human mind power so the designers have to balance fair play with giving the computer slight (and sometimes not so slight) advantages. Often the difficulty slider will also affect this and start to ramp up cheating against you as the difficulty gets harder and lower it down as well as give you bonuses (eg a % cheaper on buildings/units) as you select the easier options. Even the Original War AI I bet has some cheats in its programming to give you a worth while opponent.
As for the EE AI specifically I know that when you create a user created map in the level editor the AI is set to cheat by default - however you can disable this feature easily (its in the user profiles thingy for players whilst editing the map). I have no idea if this cheating feature applies to regular games in skirmish or not. If you want benefit of the doubt just random gen up a few maps in the level editer - disable AI cheating and play away.
As for AI ganging up this is common problem with many RTS games and the AI - I suspect a lot of it is that it just bombards the other players with more alliance requests and such than the human players do - and thus since the AI never makes a choice as such - its more likey to get an alliance acceptance. To counter do as said and have set teams from the start and lock those teams so that its all fixed through the game.
Another thing is that you play a little like I do - that is defensivly - and AI either do well against this or hopless against it (some just can't mount an effective attack - often sending out weak waves over and over which fail to break or cause significant damage). In the case of yourself and EE you need to change your style from defence to offence. Scout and strike early at the enemny with raiding forces - cut their resources and do damange. AI are often very weak at dealing with a constant threat like that and if you are cutting up his base and resources he can't cut up yours
Posted March 24, 2010
Empire Earth does indeed use a cheating AI. I discovered it during some skirmish games after I had my a** destroyed too many times ;-) I haven't played this wonderful game for ages, but I remember having disabled the fog of war to observe the beginning of a random game : the computer seems to have been given faster and cheaper buildings, while it doesn't have to wait for long before producing lots and lots of units (as it there were no population limit constraint, nor sufficient ressources gathered).
I also remember a statement made by a french programmer, who won a scenario competition with an impressive map, full of complex triggers and AI tweaks : he was disappointed to discover that the AI was cheating, having first thought that it was a true programming performance by Stainless Steel.
Anyway, I am not criticising the fact that the AI is cheating or not. It is not much of a problem : if the game is fun, entertaining and skill-raising, then it's OK. EE was shipped in 2001 : back in the day, I felt it was a wonderful improvement over other RTS games offline-wise. A high difficulty, combined with an efficient "rock-paper-scissors" system that could be easily verified on the field, has helped me a lot to improve my skills and use them back into other RTS. Of course, it was frustrating at times, but overall it was one of the best experiences I have had. I still have good memories of EE, mostly because I had fun to play campaigns, I could challenge the (cheating) AI while learning to play well, I could play against talented players online, and last but not least, enjoy one of the best editors ever built. The trigger system and map design are just perfect ! I was able to master them, while I was the biggest noob on earth at that time (16 years old, without any experience in computer programmation or design).
Well, I may surely not be impartial because of the good memories and my love for Rick Goodman's games. But I recommend you to persevere, you will learn to develop your skills. I prefer to suffer a little and to enjoy a great rewarding feeling in the end, than to play bland and easy campaigns ; plus you can find nice scenarios made by the community. Hey, I almost forgot : EE's idea of aircraft fuel management is awesome ! Sometimes you have to risk yourself in enemy territory to build a new airport because you are out of range... A very great idea. Sad that Mad Doc Software did not go on with that concept in EE2 (airplanes can now fly without limits).
P.S.: Please forgive me if there are some mistakes, english language is not my mother tongue... I tried my best - first post on Gog.com btw ;-)
Post edited March 24, 2010 by UnF
Posted April 05, 2010
avatar
billramey: I'm late to this party, but here's a quick comment. AI players will gang up on you if you don't specify teams. I usually put myself on a team with one AI ally and then put two AI opponents on a second team. It makes for a nicely balanced game, and the ally AI in EE seems to be much better than ally AIs in other games.
Overall, EE is an acquired taste. It isn't quite like AOE or AOE 2, but it's a polished RTS with a solid AI.

Not a great design choice, if true. Common sense would suggest that they'd all fight each other. No logical reason to all gang up on the human player that I can see. This happens if I am the leading nation or not.
avatar
Razzoul: I know I am replying late also, but here is my two cents
First most older games has this what you call a "cheating" AI
Civilazation and EE are harder RTS's, and will take the time and effort to get into them and decently good at them
And for EE it doesnt "know" where your bases are, but oddly sends a ton of scouts then calls it a day when the AI's scouts do find your base. The only way EE "cheats" is the avg common flaw of using a AI. Also the sense of the nature of EE, the computer will make you work hard even on the easiest setting..... and for god sakes never do a huge FFA, because once in a while all computer players will attack you at once.
try a team v team match, or just one vs one to get the hang of things. Also looking at the chart of what counters what helps a TON.

Sorry, but your post is almost impossible to understand. It's as if you were speaking a different language.
avatar
UnF: Empire Earth does indeed use a cheating AI. I discovered it during some skirmish games after I had my a** destroyed too many times ;-) I haven't played this wonderful game for ages, but I remember having disabled the fog of war to observe the beginning of a random game : the computer seems to have been given faster and cheaper buildings, while it doesn't have to wait for long before producing lots and lots of units (as it there were no population limit constraint, nor sufficient ressources gathered).
I also remember a statement made by a french programmer, who won a scenario competition with an impressive map, full of complex triggers and AI tweaks : he was disappointed to discover that the AI was cheating, having first thought that it was a true programming performance by Stainless Steel.
Anyway, I am not criticising the fact that the AI is cheating or not. It is not much of a problem : if the game is fun, entertaining and skill-raising, then it's OK. EE was shipped in 2001 : back in the day, I felt it was a wonderful improvement over other RTS games offline-wise. A high difficulty, combined with an efficient "rock-paper-scissors" system that could be easily verified on the field, has helped me a lot to improve my skills and use them back into other RTS. Of course, it was frustrating at times, but overall it was one of the best experiences I have had. I still have good memories of EE, mostly because I had fun to play campaigns, I could challenge the (cheating) AI while learning to play well, I could play against talented players online, and last but not least, enjoy one of the best editors ever built. The trigger system and map design are just perfect ! I was able to master them, while I was the biggest noob on earth at that time (16 years old, without any experience in computer programmation or design).
Well, I may surely not be impartial because of the good memories and my love for Rick Goodman's games. But I recommend you to persevere, you will learn to develop your skills. I prefer to suffer a little and to enjoy a great rewarding feeling in the end, than to play bland and easy campaigns ; plus you can find nice scenarios made by the community. Hey, I almost forgot : EE's idea of aircraft fuel management is awesome ! Sometimes you have to risk yourself in enemy territory to build a new airport because you are out of range... A very great idea. Sad that Mad Doc Software did not go on with that concept in EE2 (airplanes can now fly without limits).
P.S.: Please forgive me if there are some mistakes, english language is not my mother tongue... I tried my best - first post on Gog.com btw ;-)

Although the game is junk, and a ripoff because of this, it is a great relief for someone to confirm that because the programmers were unable to create a genuinely decent AI, they deliberately set it up with insanely huge cheats. Thanks for your comments.
Unless you can turn off cheating by the AI, the game is worthless.
Unless you can win by careful resource management and a mostly-defensive strategy, the game is JUNK.
I feel raped by this game.
Post edited April 05, 2010 by bearcat33
Posted April 05, 2010
You can turn off AI cheating in a single player game by using the scenario editor.
Posted April 05, 2010
I think it's time to call the waaaaambulance. I personally don't care anymore what you think of the game.
If someone REALLY doesn't want even try to practice or take our advice to understand the game, all that's left is mockery.
Posted April 05, 2010
avatar
BoxOfSnoo: I think it's time to call the waaaaambulance. I personally don't care anymore what you think of the game.
If someone REALLY doesn't want even try to practice or take our advice to understand the game, all that's left is mockery.

"I" and "personally" are redundant. YOU are the one worthy of mockery. Go back to third grade and learn some grammar.
avatar
ThatNamelessOne: You can turn off AI cheating in a single player game by using the scenario editor.

I haven't seen any such option. What exactly is it named? What else appears on that page?
Post edited April 05, 2010 by bearcat33
Posted April 05, 2010
You can turn off AI cheating in a single player game by using the scenario editor.
I haven't seen any such option. What exactly is it named? What else appears on that page?

Start a single player game.
Save it as soon as it starts.
Quit the game.
Navigate to the saved games folder. Saved games have an extension .ees. Change the extension to .scn.
Move the file to the scenarios folder.
Start Empire Earth and go to the scenario editor and load your saved game which is now a scenario. (Avoid looking at the world map if you don't want a "spoiler".)
Go to players and AI settings. Uncheck the box under cheat for all computer players. (See attached screenshot.)
Exit game.
Changed your file extension back to .ees and move back to save game folder and play.
The computer opponents are forced to gather resources like a human player.
I agree that it would have been nice to have a pause feature where you could issue commands.
(Pax Imperia: Imminent Domain had such a system. Another great RTS.)
There are four game speed options for single player though: slow, standard, fast, and very fast.
The game does cheat quite a bit on hard difficulty. I've noticed it gives itself resources.
I've never noticed myself being ganged up on though. It seems the computer players are as likely to bash each other as me.
I do love the game. It's one of my all time favorite RTS games.
I don't know how much you've played the game, but experiment some. Try different maps, settings, etc. There are some excellent random map scripts at EEHeaven.
Attachments:
cheat.jpg (126 Kb)
Post edited April 05, 2010 by ThatNamelessOne
Posted April 20, 2010
avatar
ThatNamelessOne:
You can turn off AI cheating in a single player game by using the scenario editor.
I haven't seen any such option. What exactly is it named? What else appears on that page?

Start a single player game.
Save it as soon as it starts.
Quit the game.
Navigate to the saved games folder. Saved games have an extension .ees. Change the extension to .scn.
Move the file to the scenarios folder.
Start Empire Earth and go to the scenario editor and load your saved game which is now a scenario. (Avoid looking at the world map if you don't want a "spoiler".)
Go to players and AI settings. Uncheck the box under cheat for all computer players. (See attached screenshot.)
Exit game.
Changed your file extension back to .ees and move back to save game folder and play.
The computer opponents are forced to gather resources like a human player.
I agree that it would have been nice to have a pause feature where you could issue commands.
(Pax Imperia: Imminent Domain had such a system. Another great RTS.)
There are four game speed options for single player though: slow, standard, fast, and very fast.
The game does cheat quite a bit on hard difficulty. I've noticed it gives itself resources.
I've never noticed myself being ganged up on though. It seems the computer players are as likely to bash each other as me.
I do love the game. It's one of my all time favorite RTS games.
I don't know how much you've played the game, but experiment some. Try different maps, settings, etc. There are some excellent random map scripts at EEHeaven.

FYI, there is a pause feature. If memory serves, I believe it's mapped to the F3 key.
Thanks for the info. I had been wishing for more maps. I'll have to check out those map scripts at EEHeaven and figure out how to use them.
I wasn't sure if the AI cheated, but I suspected. It actually makes me feel better knowing this since I usually play on slow, pausing often. I just thought I was bad. :)
In any case, EE is one of my all time favorite games.
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Empire Earth seriesBoredom, then utter Panic. Lousy game.(20 posts)(20 posts)
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