Posted December 05, 2018
scientiae: [...]While most people are drawn to the visceral responsiveness of the former, I would caution you to think more kindly about the latter. Having a skill barrier for a game unavoidably prevents those without such skills from playing it.[...]
Sufyan: [1] I think you may be reading something in my post that isn't there. "Good shooting/melee/action" is about game feeling. Do you feel like you're pointing the gun, does the impact of the bullet feel intuitive and powerful? Does your melee attack feel like it connects, do you feel your weapon swing through the air and strike where you expect it to? Does combat feel like a dance where you're trying to get the upper hand and stay on top of things? Does it feel like you can deliver shockingly efficient violence on unsuspecting foes? Deus Ex does not deliver on any of these points. From the moment you get off the docks to the point where you have upgraded your favorite weapon to 100% precision and max damage, combat never attains a great gameplay feel. Your cross hair takes up half the screen and won't tighten up for several seconds at the beginning of the game, and in the late game the lacklustre game feel of the weapons and the peculiarities of the AI makes combat forgettably unsatisfying.
You can argue that not being able to reliably mass kill your way through the game helps reinforce diverse gameplay and validate other methods, but that is really only explaining why combat is shoddy. The point of my original post is that most things in Deus Ex, viewed in a vacuum, are bad or mediocre, but taken all together they add up to one great game.
Sufyan: [2] I've never seen anyone say the XP to skillpoint system is good. …
Sufyan: [3] It's just bad stealth gameplay, no comparison or excuses necessary. It is the primary gameplay style for myself and seemingly most players because it is very efficient and clearly the game is a strong proponent of non-lethal and stealthy decision making (mechanically only relevant in the first mission, but it hammers in the lesson with much fervor). Still, despite having crawled for possibly 100 hours total over the years, I don't have a problem saying it isn't great. Everyone knows the AI cone of vision is quite silly and at anything below the hardest difficulty setting the AI reaction time is farcial so long as you stay crouched regardless of circumstance. I try not to think about it while playing, but it doesn't stand up to scrutiny.
[4] So, to reiterate my point: Deus Ex is made up of shoddy game mechanics, none of them are good on their own. Somehow, they all add up to something far greater. The sense of freedom, and more importantly, that the game responds to your choices (what you do and in which order you do things matter) and there is a feeling that fate branches organically (some paths need not be taken, some will be made unavailable or open up) rather than through obvious checkpoints and scripting. You can creep around for most of the game, but decide that this one group of evil henchmen needs being taken out, or that one door is best blown open etc, and the game accomodates your line of thinking seamlessly. No one thing feels great, but the freedom to weave in and out of different mindsets, coupled with a bit of imagination and tolerance for abstract mechanics, makes for a potentially excellent gaming experience.
[2] Well, your point is valid. I would counter that the RPG elements may be a bit clunky from a roleplay perspective, but they add another dimension to the gameplay, nonetheless.
Engendering a choice, creating the opportunity to customize a playthrough, so that one might improve Denton's ability to fight or hide, or even a little of both (radar transparency but no silent running, for instance) makes the game deeper and affords more replayability. Just like the augmentations, which require a choice in potency and specificity ([e.g.[/i], a drone to spy or an anti-missile defence: how far away from Denton?) the ability to adapt and prioritize a particular ability give greater agency to the player.
So it wasn't perfect; the point was that the implementation sparked other developers to create better games, once they saw how the implementation worked — and didn't.
But the critical factor that created such an impact was giving the player more agency.
[3] The whole point is that, in a single game, the player can choose to be a tank or a ghost (or a compromise somewhere in between). In a single-player, character-based profession-facilitated first-person perspective.
I'm curious to know if there is any game that you think has implemented stealth well. Did you like Thief, for example? Did you think it was a better implementation? Having both games (actually, all three Thiefs) I much prefer to sneak around as Denton than Garrett. YMMD.
[4] Exactly. The game has a synergy of all the gameplay styles available and, depending on the investment of RPG equity in offence (like marksmanship with a rifle versus a rocket-propelled gun) and defence (like stealthy silent running or radio transparency) the player can act with better or worse constraints.
The sheer range of options is appealing.
There is nothing to prevent a stealthy Denton from a toe-to-toe fight (apart from the injuries!) so, as you say, the incidental decision that a particular bad guy needs to die horribly painfully can be accommodated. Joy is burning a mook with chemical weapons, and laughing while they run around in a circle screaming! Or pepper spray to the face with a follow-up clubbing to knock them out: "Sit down and shut up!"
edit: clarity
Post edited December 05, 2018 by scientiae