Common in the USA it is really a joke, your so known politicians change from a CEO position to congress and then it's not elite rule ? I prefer the rule of the law, then the elite could not do anything against that or ? In a democracy you can easily persuade the masses with the mass media and just manipulate them. You really think Cameron is the elite ? Surely not an intellectual men just as dumb as most of them today. Take away the teleprompter from Obama and he is doomed.

How is this advocating elite rule? I don't agree with slash that most everyone is brainwashed idiots, but he is right about the U.S. Our government is a constitutional republic, not a democracy. The only thing democratic about it is voting for representatives, who are then supposed to be bound by the Constitution and its' amendments.

So in theory, voting is actually kind of pointless if the representatives are only allowed to do what is written in their constitution (yeah, like politicians aren't going to try to get around that). Where voting can be crucial is when a constitutional amendment is being considered either to be passed or to be repealed. That should be the only way politicians can influence a constitution. Whatever laws they try to pass that contradict their constitution is null and void (well, maybe not until a court rules that way, which is the major shorfalling of our system, IMO). It was established well before Ayn Rand ever came around.

There's been other systems proposed for "elite" rule. Starship Troopers was basically a fictional work suggesting just such a system, only it wasn't the elite who ruled, it was people who proved that they could put others before themselves who ruled (book, not the movie, which was a funny spoof, but lost all the social commentary aspects of the book).

It's not an idea without its charms, only allow the vote to people who spend time serving in actual country defense (not fighting wars across the globe) or serving others (building homes/infrastructure for the state). If you've provided for basic needs (shelter, food, healthcare) you haven't excluded anyone due to poverty, I'd argue any remaining disenfranchisement is more just than what the US has now.

The problem with a constitutional republic that works as you think it should is that it would not adapt very well to change. That may be exactly why you like it but there is no denying that we humans as a species constantly yearn to change, to evolve. It is in our blood. I'm all for preserving morality, honor and family but some things must change. Our world is ever changing, constantly throwing at us new challenges and if we fail to respond properly we are left in the dust (or as dust).

Well, there's always meritocracy....

That doesn't make them "stupid", just "ignorant". Pretty much like most of what you've posted in this thread. Ignorant to an extreme bordering on American. you sure you're from Austria?

There IS a difference. One cannot learn easily, the other doesn't wish to learn.

You know, there are MANY people who vote only knowing facts provided by TV

you ask: DO YOU KNOW your party's political programme
they answer: no, why should i?

or they just say: "I won't vote on XXX because he's not catholic / he doesn't have a wife"

I find the best political system to be ARISTOCRACY when only the BEST (in education and posessions/wealth) can vote.

I would like to see a government created only from professors and businessman rather than it's now. Politicians are mostly more stupid than a flower in the pot...

So, you basically want a plutocracy, then?

Also, wouldn't " I find the best political system to be ARISTOCRACY when only the BEST (in education and posessions/wealth) can vote. " rule you out of the loop since you may not be wealthy?

You could always institute a poll tax. They did it in England with *fantastic* results.... /sarcasm

Indeed im from Austria and well just look at UK or USA today. If the founding fathers of the USA would see USA today..... They would rethink to found this country for sure...

Plutocracy is the rule of the wealth. I mean the rule of the wealth AND educated I am not wealthy. I can't find any argument to make EVERYONE have right to vote.

The system where TWO alcoholics can overvote and Einstein is just pure ABSURD.

See the problem is that the rich have the best access to education whereas citizens like you and I are stuck with either working until we retire on crappy social security or going to a government-run college.

I have looked up some of our politicians as far as their educations go and I see that our PM has a historical education while his primary opponent, Kaczyński, has a law degree, IIRC.

And they're rich so according to your criteria they are perfectly qualified to rule the country.

Yep. And you see nothing wrong when a MORON like Donald Tusk is a prime minister of Poland? He knows nothing about economics and he decides about your life!

It's bullshit.

ps. Kaczynski become wealthy AFTER becoming a politician. Before that he was NOONE. He didn't have a company, he didn't work. He earned his money being a politician ONLY. Another pure bullshit. We've got many people in the parliment who are only POLITICIANS and nothing more. Haven't achieved anything in their lives.

You never stated in your original post that the wealthy and educated had to know anything about economics. Not trying to troll you, just trying to have a discussion.

Becoming a politician doesn't necessarily mean you automatically gain power. He and his party can vote on bills being introduced in the Senat, not sure about the Sejm as I rarely see any news coverage about it, but I don't think by himself JK has any actual power along the lines of the PM or the President. I could be wrong, however.

Becoming a politician and wealthy as a result of doing so doesn't count as an achievement? I am sure it wasn't just handed to them on a silver plate.

You know, when aristocracy cames along, you would may minimize sejm to 40 people and have senat disappeared.

I would gladly give away my right to vote if I was sure that only educated and wealthy BOTH would have place in parliment.

Imagine a goverment which contains only from the experts of law who suceeded in courts, experts of economics who have strong companies, and experts of any other discipline who achieved something in their life.

Kaczynski is an PhD of Law but he hasn't achieve ANYTHING in that discipline. It's just a degree without any success... It's not any accomplishment to have a Master's degree or PhD nowadays...

Also, they know nothing about life. They don't pay taxes (because their salary comes from th budget, so from mine and your pocket...), they don't rule their companies, they don't have to work...

they just sit and vote and make money on that, and nothing else.

What about checks and balances? What would stop these ubermenschen from using their seats of power for their own purposes? After all, look at the current situation in our country where it feels like we are being robbed by the government.