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General discussionAnnouncing The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt - Expansion Pass(1100 posts)(1100 posts)
(1100 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted April 07, 2015
Two full-blown expansions for the epic RPG.




The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt is almost here. That means the game is pretty much finished, and the devs are about to take a deep breath while CD-presses and hype machines slowly wind up to take things through the home stretch. It's not gold yet, but now that development is coming to an end, the CD PROJEKT RED team is ready to start their work on two new, ambitious monster-hunting expansions.

The expansions will be called <span class="bold">Hearts of Stone</span>, and <span class="bold">Blood and Wine</span>. Combined, they'll offer over 30 hours of new adventures for Geralt, and the latter introduces a whole new major area to roam. More items, gear, and characters (including a few familiar faces) will all be crafted with the same attention to detail as the game itself.
<span class="bold">Hearts of Stone</span> is a 10-hour adventure across the wilds of No Man's Land and the nooks of Oxenfurt. The secretive Man of Glass has a contract for you - you'll need all your smarts and cunning to untangle a thick web of deceit, investigate the mystery, and emerge in one piece.
<span class="bold"><span class="bold">Blood and Wine</span></span> is the big one, introducing an all-new, playable in-game region to The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt. It will take you about 20 hours to discover all of Toussaint, a land of wine, untainted by war. And to uncover the dark, bloody secret behind an atmosphere of carefree indulgence.







There used to be a time when buying an add-on disk or expansion for your game really meant something. That's what CD PROJEKT RED are going for, it's about bringing that old feeling back. You can take it from our very own iWi, (that's Marcin Iwinski, co-founder of CD PROJEKT RED):

"We’ve said in the past that if we ever decide to release paid content, it will be vast in size and represent real value for the money. Both of our expansions offer more hours of gameplay than quite a few standalone games out there.”

Hearts of Stone is expected to premiere this October, while Blood and Wine is slated for release in the first quarter of 2016, so there's still plenty of time ahead. We're offering you the <span class="bold">Expansion Pass</span> now - it's a chance to pre-order the two expansions and even show your support for the devs. But we can't stress Marcin Iwinski's words enough:

“Don’t buy it if you have any doubts. Wait for reviews or play The Witcher and see if you like it first. As always, it’s your call."







The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt is just over a month away, and you can pre-order the game right now - it's a particularly great deal if you own the previous Witcher games and take advantage of the additional fan discount (both The Witcher and The Witcher 2: Assassins of Kings are 80% off right now!). You can also take a rather unique refresher course on the universe with The Witcher Adventure Game at a 40% discount, all until Thursday, 4:59 PM GMT.
Post edited April 07, 2015 by Chamb
Posted April 09, 2015
high rated
Hello Everyone,

First of all let me thank you for your feedback. Although a bit harsh at times, it is always very passionate, emotional and we really do appreciate it.

I wanted to add a few words to the original press release, which will hopefully shed some more light on the Expansions and the timing of the announcement.

Let me start with the Expansions themselves. The work on The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt is almost done and we are waiting for the final certifications. Thanks to it we were able to allocate part of the team onto the expansions. Yes, we have been thinking about it for some time, as with over 250 people on the Witcher team good planning is essential.

Rest assured, there is no hidden agenda or cutting out any content from the game. Both Expansions are being built at this very moment, from the ground up – hence the release dates long after the launch of Wild Hunt. We develop them in-house by the same team, which was working on Wild Hunt. This is the best guarantee we can give you that our goal is to deliver both the story and production values on par with the main game.

Now, on the timing of the announcement - in other words “why now” and not - let’s say – “a few months after the release of Wild Hunt”. The reason is very simple: we want to get the word out about the Expansions to as many gamers as possible out there. There is no better time for it than during the apex of the Marketing & PR campaign of the game. Doing it sometime after the release would mean that our reach would be much smaller.

Yes, we are a business, and yes, we would love to see both the game and the Expansions selling well. Having said that, we always put gamers first and are actually quite paranoid about the fact that whatever we offer is honest, of highest quality, and represents good value for your hard earn buck.

Yes, these are just my words. So let me repeat myself from the original release: if you still have any doubts -- don’t buy the Expansions. Wait for reviews or play The Witcher and see if you like it first. As always, it’s your call.

Cheers,

Marcin
Post edited April 09, 2015 by Destro
Posted April 09, 2015
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Dju: Now I wonder how different the reaction would've been if they had announced it differently. What if they had simply said that they had big plans to extend the Witcher 3 experience by planning expansions packs? Nothing more, no pre-ordering yet, no "Pass" in the name.
That's the smart thing to do, why they do not do so is beyond me.

Since they plan to release witcher 3 in a month time, why now wait until then? If it is good even more people will buy the pre-order expansion.
Posted April 09, 2015
DLC vs Expansion has always been a difficult debate and is pretty subjective.

Sure, while the Expansion pass is a whole 30 hours (sounds expansion worthy), Hearts of Stone is only 10. How is that different from say, Borderlands 2 Tiny Tina's Dragon Keep DLC? That one is 6-11.5 hours depending on how completionist you want to be. Should that have been called an expansion pack instead then? I don't find it so strange that with DLC like the above people find it difficult to call what CDP claims to offer here as 'expansions' is much different from DLC.

On a personal note, I personally can't stand DLC that take me out of a game and into a completely different scenario for god knows how many hours, or need to be played separately entirely (like many of the Dragon Age ones). When I think expansion I think of things like Enemy Within for XCOM, an expansion that broadens and expands on the game that's already there to enhance that experience. If they're just going to drag me into a completely different experience/tale/story/scenario then I'd rather developers instead start working on a new game or full sequel. (in short, Blood and Wine sounds more like the kind of 'expansion' I'd like. That said, despite my above opinion, Tiny Tina's DLC was awesome... love that inconsistency :p)
Post edited April 09, 2015 by Pheace
Posted April 09, 2015
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Kristian: If you aren't against preordering in general then presumably you have some criteria you use to evalueate preorder offers, if the The Witcher 3 preorder offer passed the test a week ago, nothing has changed to make it fail that test now.
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stg83: Well there are a few people that are against preordering in general but were willing to make an exception to support CDPR secure in the knowledge that they would get anything and everything related to the game similar to the previous Witcher games without any additional content being sold separately.

Obviously this new information about the expansions has shattered their belief as CDPR is now selling a Season Pass just like most of the other AAA developers, so thats why some of the reaction you are observing is harsh as these folks don't like buying game content in the form of piecemeal. Granted the option is now available to buy the game+expansions but that makes it takes a bigger toll on the wallets of folks like P1na at the moment so they will wait for the eventual full version.

Marcin's post made it clear that CDPR like any other business is in it to make as much money as possible and not do things any differently then the marketing strategies employed by other companies out there. But they intend to differ in terms of offering real value for money with actual significant add-on content. But so early in the stage of development while The Witcher 3 isn't even out yet, it is not possible to ascertain whether the expansions will be worthwhile for the asking price as only time will tell.
What CDPR is offering here is VASTLY different from the industry norm. The industry norm is things like(hypothetical examples) paying $20 for 2 maps and 2 guns or something like that. You are getting many times the bang for the buck than the industry norm. Many, many, many times.

" Obviously this new information "

This is 100% consistent with the stance that CDPR has had for years, the DLC vs expansion distinction is NOT new information: http://www.giantbomb.com/articles/the-witcher-2-dlc-wont-cost-you-a-dime-but-expansi/1100-3203/
Posted April 09, 2015
I think the biggest problem was announcing the expansion pre-order before the game even releases. It gives the impression, right or wrong, that the game was broken up into parts ala Starcraft 2.
Posted April 09, 2015
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Davane: From what I have seen of the Expansion Pass, the content within doesn't appear to qualify as expansions, either singular or combined.

It's like saying that the Kingmaker Module for NWN is an 'Expansion' - it isn't. Hordes of the Underdark is an expansion for NWN. Kingmaker is a Module.

I guess a lot of this comes from me as a table roleplayer/board gamer. Aside from the metagame products and accessories, you get two basic types of products: Rules/Sourcebooks and Adventures. I would consider the first to be an "Expansion" where as I do not consider the second to be. This is because the two products have different scopes.

Likewise, I see an expansion has having different scope than other types of DLC. Neither of the options offered up by CDPR share the scope of an Expansion in my view at this point. It doesn't mean that they are not viable as DLC - just that I fail to see how these offerings are different from other forms of DLC in the past.

It has been argued that TW3 is likely to only have additional story content as a story-driven game. That's fine, and I agree with that. However, that means that what CDPR are offering is your standard DLC Season Pass for episodic content. Nothing wrong with that at all.

I just wish that CDPR would not perpetuate such confusion that leads to the inevitable sense of betrayal that results from them appearing to be champions against all DLC when they are not, and this provokes people to support a company that they would not have considered supporting.
All-right. Fair enough. You seem consistent in your definition and react rationally according to said definition, that's more than I can say for most I've "argued" with.

Personally, I don't like the term "DLC" at all (because all it says is "downloadable content", which really describes the base game as well in many cases), but would instead personally use "minor additional content" for what isn't "big enough" (loose definition indeed) to be called an "expansion", regardless of how much of the added content consists of each of rule changes, story pieces, and art assets. I will postpone my judgement of these announced add-ons until further information is revealed.
Posted April 09, 2015
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Davane: It is just a shame that that wasn't their business model after all.

How do you know that these two "expansions" are the last of them to be made for TW3?

Yours may not be a standard viewpoint, but it is an understandable one.
It is a shame indeed. And I don't know if these two expansions will be the only ones, that's also annoying me. Just as they're free to charge whatever they want for whatever they want, I'm also free to purchase or not.

Thanks for saying my viewpoint is understandable, that's all I've been looking forward to all this time. I've been mildly annoyed at all these blanket comments about how this announcement couldn't possibly be a reason for canceling a preorder and anyone doing so must be an entitled whiny manchild; and ignore me when I point out a reason why it can be a reason for someone. Even if there are certainly people who are whiny or misunderstand the announcement.
Posted April 09, 2015
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Davane: Can you link it again... I miss it...
and [url=http://www.gog.com/upload/forum/2014/11/eb934e64dd71734558cf52ab139c1fdadaa2686a.gif]here. I usually link the first picture, but there is the second one as well, for a different view at them.

Test Drive 2 is a lovely game for anyone that wishes for more of the old days, since it seems that most things people complain about today, they already did.
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Gnostic: the pre-order expansion.
Pre-order expansion? Ah, you mean they can pre-order the expansion, like you can also do in August or September. Or you can wait until Heart of Stone is released, before pre-ordering the pass that has one released and one unreleased expansion.

Or did I miss something?
Post edited April 09, 2015 by JMich
Posted April 09, 2015
http://it.ign.com/the-witcher-3-pc/95575/news/the-witcher-3-wild-hunt-ha-un-tema-ps4-per-il-preo

There's also a PS4 theme if you pre-order the game.
Posted April 09, 2015
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jalister: I don't know if this is true, but I would think the GOG and CDPR are two separate companies. The success or failure of one should not affect the other.
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Trilarion: GOG is a 100% subsidiary of CDP, so they are only two separate companies on paper but CDP owns GOG completely.

I don't want to say that there is any high danger of it but with TW3 being a huge investment for CDP which could easily fail there is the real possibility that CDP gets liquidated. In this case GOG would have to be sold to someone else possibly embracing DRM or if no buyer is found, GOG would have to close. This is of course the worst case.

So, just in case we might want to hope that TW3 is actually not that bad. And I don't think it is.
I suspect TW3 will be a good game, and sell well. I do have all my games backed up though, just in case. :P
Posted April 09, 2015
Hi iWi,

First of all thanks a lot for replying on this thread, CDPR and GOG's active involvement in the community is one thing I appreciate a lot.

I globally agree with what you told us, but would like to comment on/disagree with a couple of things:

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iWi: Now, on the timing of the announcement - in other words “why now” and not - let’s say – “a few months after the release of Wild Hunt”. The reason is very simple: we want to get the word out about the Expansions to as many gamers as possible out there. There is no better time for it than during the apex of the Marketing & PR campaign of the game. Doing it sometime after the release would mean that our reach would be much smaller.
This is the part I don't agree with. The way I see it you don't need to launch another hype train on the same tracks as the Witcher 3 hype train which is already going full steam (pun not intentional).
To me it would have been sufficient to announce the timelines of the planned expansion packs (surfing on the Witcher 3 wave) and then wait until later to create the buzz around those expansions.

I mean I didn't study marketing but I'm sure there's a good period of the year between now and the expansion release to start a separate PR campaign, ain't it?

All in all I believe it is not the announcement itself but rather the fact the you already started the pre-orders for it that is creating such a bad buzz. And of course it's already started leading to all kinds of speculations :-)

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iWi: Yes, these are just my words. So let me repeat myself from the original release: if you still have any doubts -- don’t buy the Expansions. Wait for reviews or play The Witcher and see if you like it first. As always, it’s your call.
Glad you're taking - and sticking to - that stance. To me any game creator/publisher should have the cojones to tell this to its potential customers. Not sure you're gonna like it? Let the professionals and your fellow gamers test drive it for you.

Now I'm going back to waiting for a nice boxed copy which will include the expansions :-)
Post edited April 09, 2015 by Dju
Posted April 09, 2015
OK. I have decided. I will keep my preorder for TW3 just to show support for CDPR. Since I got TW1 and TW2 really cheap that makes it really reasonable from an "average price" perspective. But I would not buy the expansion pass now and from now on I would never preorder any games, not only CDPR games but all games.
Time and again it has been proven that preorder usually is not a good idea to consumers. I was very happy that I did not preorder Diablo 3 although Blizzard had a very good track records of delivering solid products upon release. Despite record sales and huge number of preorders Diablo 3 had tons of issues at launch time and was only became mature months after release. I probably would not play TW3 or even download it upon release. But I trust CDPR would continue to provide strong support and only to make it better like Blizzard did with Diablo 3 and what they did with TW1 and TW2. For the record I got Diablo 3 and the expansion together for 2/3 of the list price of Diablo 3. So from a purely cost/benefits perspective it was well worth the wait. It is up to everyone to make their own decisions based on their personal situation/preferences. CDPR broke the industry record by selling expansions that don't even exist before the release date of the main product.....
Posted April 09, 2015
I am happy this happened. I got to cancel the preorder and spend a 4th of the money on Stick of Truth. Best decision ever.
Posted April 09, 2015
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iWi: Now, on the timing of the announcement - in other words “why now” and not - let’s say – “a few months after the release of Wild Hunt”. The reason is very simple: we want to get the word out about the Expansions to as many gamers as possible out there. There is no better time for it than during the apex of the Marketing & PR campaign of the game. Doing it sometime after the release would mean that our reach would be much smaller.
I have no doubt at all that the expansions will be high quality and worth the money. But I still have to disagree with the timing. For me this actually severely deflated my interest in pre-ordering the base game and in general. When a game isn't even in my hands yet I have no desire to even know about future content, let alone pay for it. I think this has had the opposite effect you intended with a lot of people.

Judging by the position of popularity the expansion pass is at on the home page I guess i'm a minority though.
Post edited April 09, 2015 by MikeMaximus
Posted April 09, 2015
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Gnostic: the pre-order expansion.
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JMich: Pre-order expansion? Ah, you mean they can pre-order the expansion, like you can also do in August or September. Or you can wait until Heart of Stone is released, before pre-ordering the pass that has one released and one unreleased expansion.

Or did I miss something?
Now it is pre-order the expansion of another per-order. Asking money for something that does not exist that is build on another thing that does not exist yet.

Invoking good memories of expansion of old but using key words like pre-order expansion pass which invoke unhappy memories of how other publishers abuse them seasonal pass.

Logically these should be not much difference when they take these new per-order, as the result would be quite similar. Like every other pre-order, people don't even need to buy it now.

But guess what, this is the internet, where the innocent until proven guilty rule does not apply. Without something solid like actually having a great experience on the Witcher 3 to dispel fears and build up goodwill, people will act on their bias.


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iWi: Now, on the timing of the announcement - in other words “why now” and not - let’s say – “a few months after the release of Wild Hunt”. The reason is very simple: we want to get the word out about the Expansions to as many gamers as possible out there. There is no better time for it than during the apex of the Marketing & PR campaign of the game. Doing it sometime after the release would mean that our reach would be much smaller.
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Dju: This is the part I don't agree with. The way I see it you don't need to launch another hype train on the same tracks as the Witcher 3 hype train which is already going full steam (pun not intentional).
To me it would have been sufficient to announce the timelines of the planned expansion packs (surfing on the Witcher 3 wave) and then wait until later to create the buzz around those expansions.

I mean I didn't study marketing but I'm sure there's a good period of the year between now and the expansion release to start a separate PR campaign, ain't it?

All in all I believe it is not the announcement itself but rather the fact the you already started the pre-orders for it that is creating such a bad buzz. And of course it's already started leading to all kinds of speculations :-)
Agreed
Post edited April 09, 2015 by Gnostic
Posted April 09, 2015
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Gnostic: Now it is pre-order the expansion of another per-order. Asking money for something that does not exist that is build on another thing that does not exist yet.
So be "The pre-order expansion" you mean "the expansion that you can pre-order" and not an expansion that is available if you pre-order the main game only, or something like that.
Thank you :)
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Community
General discussionAnnouncing The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt - Expansion Pass(1100 posts)(1100 posts)
(1100 posts)